3-days in and no threads about Gaza

[MTAtech]

I think this thread is covering too many issues. If we're talking about the recent Gaza events it makes no sense expanding it to questioning Israel's existence and formation. On that note, I must object to the following quote:

Quote:

Its seed can be traced to the basic fallacy of the Zionist movement, which set out to establish a Jewish-national state in a location already inhabited by another nation.

Before 1948 there was no nation there. If you disagree, who was the president or monarch? It was a territory controlled by the British.

However, that's 60 year old history. The Hamas issue is not a Palestinian issue. Hamas is a hardline hostile entity -- so hardline that even Egypt closed the border with Gaza. If Hamas was as moderate as Fatah there wouldn't be any problem. Israel negotiating with Hamas is like Britain negotiating with al Qaeda.

[tony_j15]

Quote:

I just read one of your links tony, and you're rebuttal against the starvation is the "success" of so many underground tunnels dug to get around the blockade?

If you had read it, you'd notice the UN's director of the Development Program specifically said, "It's an economic crisis, a political crisis, but it's not a humanitarian crisis. People aren't starving."
If you want to show me the autopsy reports of Gazans who have starved to death, please produce them.
The tunnels are dug for many purposes. Some for food, some for weapons. Khaled Abdel Shaafi is correct in his assessment. Life in Gaza is not pleasant and much can and should be done to fix the situation.

[Chuckiechan]

Keep your eye on the northern border with Lebannon. Sources tell me that thier is a chance Iran will direct Hezbolla to start shelling soon.

Things could get interesting.

[Sarah L]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuckiechan

Keep your eye on the northern border with Lebannon. Sources tell me that thier is a chance Iran will direct Hezbolla to start shelling soon.

Things could get interesting.

Already happening.

[Sarah L]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Disley

Tet was a failure militarily but it took fierce bloody fighting from block to blpck by the marines, with artillery and air power, to eventually clear out the NVA.
With heavy casualties.
The war was seen differently from then on, the people back home had been told by the generals it was under control, seeing that on the TV news brought it home to them they weren't being told the whole truth.
Since then the military have strictly censored any military action.

Your full of shit.

[Sarah L]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sharder8

YUP!!!

That's what MOUT training and fighting is all about.

American and Isreali forces have spent a lot of time and money on training military forces specifically for this type of situation. Meanwhile, Hamas has spent time on how to utilize civilians as shields and provide propoganda from the results. Do a little research Dizzy and you'll find Hamas has, on numberous ocassions, staged some of that propoganda . . . to include killing their own shields and blaming Isreal.

BTW Dizzy, Tet was a victory for the U.S., until the press turned it into a loss. Number and facts prove the truth is not what the press presented. That is why the press was kept out of the front areas for years.


Harder

Is it not amazing how much of an indoctrinated piece of work he is. I have 6 guys here who actually was there. None of them know what he is talking about.

One of them points out the game the press played with a burning C130 on a DaNang airstrip. They showed that one plane at several different angles at different stages of burning suggesting several had been destroyed.

The press took a NVA press release saying that 3 B52's had been shot down and printed it as fact. No B52's flew that day but as usual with low lifes and a hostile press the truth is an inconvenience that interferes with their so called greater good.

BTW I work for INSCOM now

[MTAtech]

Why are talking about Vietnam? It seems like this thread went off on a tangent.

[surreal]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sarah L

Your full of shit.

It is, you're full of shit.

[MTAtech]

I would like to move away from the topic of who has an excess level of excrement.

I reject the case that lopsided casualties denote fault or guilt. Some have argued that Israel is wrong because it has much fewer casualties than Gazans. In war, that's the objective. In 1990, Iraq invaded Kuwait. The U.S. responded with overwhelming force and caused ~1,000 to 1 casualties on Iraq. Does that make the U.S. response wrong?

In WWII, Germany took far heavier loses than allied forces. Was the allied forces wrong to try to bring Hitler to his knees?

The fact is that even the U.N. says that 75-80% of casualties are Hamas fighters and the vast majority of civilian casualties are due to Hamas military activity being conducted from civilian locations. All civilized people mourn and regret any loss of innocent life.

[sharder8]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTAtech

I would like to move away from the topic of who has an excess level of excrement.

I reject the case that lopsided casualties denote fault or guilt. Some have argued that Israel is wrong because it has much fewer casualties than Gazans. In war, that's the objective. In 1990, Iraq invaded Kuwait. The U.S. responded with overwhelming force and caused ~1,000 to 1 casualties on Iraq. Does that make the U.S. response wrong?

In WWII, Germany took far heavier loses than allied forces. Was the allied forces wrong to try to bring Hitler to his knees?

The fact is that even the U.N. says that 75-80% of casualties are Hamas fighters and the vast majority of civilian casualties are due to Hamas military activity being conducted from civilian locations. All civilized people mourn and regret any loss of innocent life.

Strictly playing the devil's advocate here . . .

What's the difference between when the U.S. first went into Iraq and now Isreal going into Gaza???

It seems that many of you condemned the U.S. then . . . but not Isreal now.


Harder