Thread: 5-4 Decision Affirms Obamacare
June 29th, 2012, 03:52 PM #61
YOU HAVE A CHILD?!?!?!
Sorry, OT, but... WHAT?!
June 29th, 2012, 04:02 PM #62
Sorry, I wasn't speaking literally. In Socialist Canada you need to have a Child Rearing License (CRL) in order to have children and I haven't received mine yet.
June 29th, 2012, 04:04 PM #63
I should really do some more research on this whole thing. Being a poor fool, I'd like to know what I'm going to end up having to deal with.
June 29th, 2012, 04:59 PM #64
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if you are isolated from the cost you never pay attention to how much the industry is spending you may pay too much.
Maybe it would be better to skip the un-needed diagnostics and just give a $15 anti-biotic after testing for pneumonia the old fashioned way with a stethoscope and a few raps on the chest by old doc baker. Instead you get a $180 Blood workup, $250 dollar chest x-ray + $100 exam. if you don't get better in a week or if you degrade then try more elaborate testing. As a kid growing up they looked at my throat, ears and gave a listen to my chest sometimes even did a culture and then sent me off with a prescription. During the 90's they kept sending me off for X-Ray and Blood work. After which they would give me a scipt or not based upon their findings.
June 29th, 2012, 05:21 PM #65
Comparison of the health care systems in Canada and the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I don't expect to convince you, even though I think that any rational person could instantly tell you which system is better, all things considered. I'm just saying I'm very grateful for what we have here.
June 29th, 2012, 05:26 PM #66
I can't, for the life of me, think of any other instance where I get taxed for not doing/buying something. And unless someone can give me an example, I can't see where the precedent was for such a decision.
June 29th, 2012, 05:42 PM #67
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In Virginia (and, I assume, some other states) you have to pay an Uninsured Motor Vehicle fee if you opt to drive without liability coverage:The Virginia Uninsured Motor Vehicle (UMV) fee allows a motor vehicle owner to register an uninsured motor vehicle. At the time of registration, the motor vehicle owner must certify whether the vehicle is insured or uninsured.
If the vehicle is uninsured, the motor vehicle owner is required to pay to DMV a $500 uninsured motor vehicle fee in addition to normal registration fees. Payment of the $500 fee does not provide the motorist with any insurance coverage. If involved in an accident, the uninsured motorist remains personally liable. This fee is valid for twelve months but may be prorated for a shorter amount of time.
Motor vehicle owners who falsely certify that they have insurance and are found by DMV to be uninsured face stiff penalties. In addition to facing suspension of all driver and registration privileges, compliance includes payment of a $500 statutory fee, a $145 reinstatement fee and filing proof of insurance for three years. During the three-year period, insurance companies cooperate with DMV by providing notification if a policy is canceled. This requirement to maintain proof of insurance enables DMV to ensure that these motor vehicle owners maintain liability insurance on their registered vehicles.In judging a two-person singing contest, never award the prize to the second soprano having heard only the first.
-- Francis Bator
June 29th, 2012, 05:53 PM #68
I find the comparison to vehicle insurance to be a weak one at best. Driving is not something you are entitled to, it is a privilege and you must pay for that privilege. States do not require you to be insured for your benefit, but for the other dumbasses on the road you might end up hurting.
What we are saying here is that health care is, or at least should be, a right given to all United States citizens. Per Bingo's statement, what other _right_ are we forced to pay for? <- honest question since I have no idea, or at least I can't think of anything simple off-hand.
June 29th, 2012, 07:29 PM #69
We pay for every single right we have. Think about it.
The only difference is healthcare seems more easy to visualize because it effects everyone directly and there isn't much buffer between the costs and the results.
The First Amendment is payed for by everyone as well. But there's no direct tax for the Supreme Court (for instance) so no one complains about it.Good job, friend-of-friends!
June 29th, 2012, 07:40 PM #70
You are more clever than I am. How are we paying for our first amendment rights?
June 29th, 2012, 07:56 PM #71
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June 29th, 2012, 09:21 PM #72
Your tax dollars and mine paid for the First Amendment to be upheld. No taxes? No First Amendment. The same goes for every other right in America.Good job, friend-of-friends!
June 29th, 2012, 09:28 PM #73
Okay, I see what you mean now. I guess I see it in the opposite, we pay people to deal with other people that do things our constitutional rights don't cover. Things like slander and libel for instance. We automatically get the right to free speech, but as soon as we go overboard, our tax dollars step in and slap us silly.
I shall more deeply cogitate on this.
June 29th, 2012, 09:50 PM #74
So basically the answer is that the right to live in the USA is a taxable offense. Because, essentially, that's what this law is about. You being alive without any other attachments means you have to pay a tax. The simple act of being is taxable. I find that quite preposterous. One can choose not to drive and avoid those taxes for that privilege. Should one have to commit suicide to avoid the taxes levied for the right to life?
June 29th, 2012, 10:00 PM #75
I see the point you're trying to make, John, but it doesn't stand. No matter what, we are taxed, so no matter what, if you live and work in the US, you are paying for the privilege of living here. In that case, all OCare is doing is adding another service that is now available via those taxes. In reality, it's no different, from a taxation standpoint, than how we pay for our mail to be delivered to us.
And even if you were to remove yourself from all mail access permanently, your taxes would still pay for the mail other people have delivered. Never use the healthcare your taxes pay for? Amounts to the same thing. No opt-out for either.
June 29th, 2012, 10:30 PM #76
And that would fly if it was a government service. But it's a private sector service for which we are being taxed. It would be like the government collecting a tax to have UPS or FedEX deliver. A true single-payer government-run system would probably have no Constitutional issues because it's government insurance, not private.
June 29th, 2012, 10:35 PM #77
June 29th, 2012, 11:18 PM #78
June 30th, 2012, 10:50 AM #79
This argument would be so much easier if we had full employment, got rid of the illegals and got welfare people off the dole and into jobs.
As it stands now, there are too many people milking the system and there isn't enough money to fund it.
That, in a nut shell is the problem.
I've seen the "welfare Cadillac", and Asians with $ 20K in jewelry hanging off them using EBT cards. We have so many people on it in one form or another, there isn't enough manpower to police it.
I wish Obama would put as much effort into the economy and jobs and welfare and border enforcement as he did with this Obamacare turkey.Obama: The rich have the Federal Reserve and the poor have Harry Reid... LOL. Life really is unfair!
June 30th, 2012, 11:09 AM #80
So you're complaining that you don't like the way things are because of a situation that the conservatives in politics created.
Also, don't make it out like everyone is being taxed. That's a falsehood. The only way a penalty tax is assessed if you refuse to purchase insurance, at which point the IRS is empowered to do....guess what? NOTHING! There is no actual punishment specified in the bill. So the IRS could come knock at your door and politely ask for you to pay, or garnish your paycheck.
But really, how many situations like that are going to come up? Do you know anyone personally who doesn't want to be taken care of if/when they need medical services?
Chuck: the economy is a topic for discussion in its own thread. Let's not go there here.Good job, friend-of-friends!
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