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  1. #41
    Goverment property now GroundZero3's Avatar
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    I will check it out in vmware, but it will be a while before I bother with it on my desktop

  2. #42
    Anime Otaku RobRich's Avatar
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    Digital Storm announces $1469+ Steam Machine.
    Robert Richmond | Infinite perceptions. One reality.
    TechIMO.com Community Director

  3. #43
    Onii-san Bizkitkid2001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobRich View Post
    I read about that yesterday. Seems a bit over priced, especially when you can get an identical machine from them in a smaller case for over $300 cheaper. $300 does not justify a different case IMO.

    Also, you can spec it with a Titan but only go up to a 700watt PSU? What kind of asinine thinking is that?

    I hope other companies try and compete with iBuypower at the $500 steam machine price point, but I doubt it as iBuypower is cheap for a reason.
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  4. #44
    ...Don't Mind Me... ShyguyXPC's Avatar
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    Still going with a custom self built rig is probably cheaper, if one is building a double duty gaming pc/steam box.

  5. #45
    Onii-san Bizkitkid2001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShyguyXPC View Post
    Still going with a custom self built rig is probably cheaper, if one is building a double duty gaming pc/steam box.

    At the high end I agree, but the $500 steam box iBuypower put together is cheaper than building it yourself, and they claim it can play every game on Steam OS at 1080p60.

    IBuyPower Preps $499 High-End AMD-Based Steam Box Machine - X-bit labs

    If more reputable PC makers can compete, then Steam OS has a real chance of taking off with the console crowd (me included).
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  6. #46
    ...Don't Mind Me... ShyguyXPC's Avatar
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    Thats what I'm saying on the high end, for $1500, or so, your better off building it yourself.


    Plus, its not like this whole steamOS/steambox thing is anything exclusive, just about any PC capable of gaming, can be turned into a Steambox.

    It'd be like if Sony or MS, distributed the OS for their current gen Consoles, turning any PC with AMD APU's and Graphics into a PS4 or XB1.


    as to the claims about the $500 system able to run any game on Steam, sure, RUN any game at 1080p, but at what frame rates, detail settings, etc.

    "iBuyPower claims that existing Steam for Linux games should run quite well, at full 1080p resolution and 60 frames per second."

    Thats because MOST of the Steam Linux games currently are low end Indie titles.



    "The Steam Box from iBuyPower will be powered by a multi-core AMD processor and will be equipped with AMD Radeon R9 270 graphics card (formerly Radeon HD 7870 with 1280 stream processors), 500GB hard disk drive, Wi-Fi, Bluetooth and so on, reports The Verge web-site."

    So basically the same specs as both consoles, but with a more powerful APU.

    "The horsepower inside the iBuyPower Steam Box is considerably higher compared to that of Microsoft Xbox One and Sony PlayStation 4,"

    Not entirely true, its CPU will be more powerful (faster Clocked most likely, maybe more Cache, but not much beyond that).

    but GPU wise, the PS4 runs an AMD GPU at about the same performance level.


    Surprised their not offering Blu Ray Playback/Optical Drive. Thats one of the benefits of the PS4 (and older PS3), Though I can imagine you'd be able to easily disassemble one, and install your own slot load, or slim style BR Drive.

    unless of course Steam OS itself will not support ANY Blu Ray Playback, but being a Linux OS, I can't imagine it'd be hard to modify the OS to run it.

    Hell, probably even able to Dual Boot with Windows on your own.

    500GB Hard drive though, is going to fill up REAL Fast for some of us Steam Users.

    but then they'll maybe be pushing some sort of Cloud storage/streaming services too.

  7. #47
    Onii-san Bizkitkid2001's Avatar
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    I understand that Steam OS can be ran on any PC, my point was that for it to be competitive against consoles, PC companies need to make it appealing to console gamers. Console gamers want a fully built PC that can play all their games but not be expensive at the same time. Basically, they want a PC that is as easy to use as a console that requires no setting up and no messing around with settings.

    iBuypower is the only company that I know of that is going to release a Steam Box that competes with the consoles on price and performance. I would like to see more companies release $500 Steam Boxes so that more console gamers will gravitate to PC gaming so that PCs can hopefully get more AAA exclusives, or ideally have Microsoft, Sony, and Nintendo release their IPs for Steam OS.

    I would like to see consoles disappear, and have all games available for one tye of platform so that everyone gets a chance of playing all games without needing to own multiple systems. Microsoft, Sony, nor Nintendo actually mke money off of hardware sales. In fact, they lose money per console sold, so I have no idea why they would want to continue selling consoles when they could focus on creating games for one platform instead.
    Last edited by Bizkitkid2001; December 12th, 2013 at 05:15 PM.
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  8. #48
    AGW Trained Seal tony_j15's Avatar
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    Because they make money off the platform.

  9. #49
    Onii-san Bizkitkid2001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tony_j15 View Post
    Because they make money off the platform.
    And who says that platform has to be tied to a specific piece of hardware?

    There are already reports going around that Sony and Microsoft are both looking at no longer offering consoles in the distant future (With a lot of people saying that this new generation is the last console generation) and instead using services like Onlive and Gaikai to allow anyone to play their games on any internet connected device. Sony has already purchased Gaikai and Microsoft is working on their own cloud based streaming system.
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  10. #50
    AGW Trained Seal tony_j15's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bizkitkid2001 View Post
    And who says that platform has to be tied to a specific piece of hardware?
    Doesn't have to be, but hardware independent gaming platform often means PC space, and that's already a crowded field with a lot more money that has to be sunk into development to ensure a quality experience across a range of hardware. Which is why consoles exist.

    There are already reports going around that Sony and Microsoft are both looking at no longer offering consoles in the distant future (With a lot of people saying that this new generation is the last console generation) and instead using services like Onlive and Gaikai to allow anyone to play their games on any internet connected device. Sony has already purchased Gaikai and Microsoft is working on their own cloud based streaming system.
    With 70% of Americans now having access to some form of broadband, that could be a possibility in the future. It's an idea I've heard since the '90s that has yet to really come into fruition. But the impending demise of the console as we know it is exaggerated, thankfully.

  11. #51
    Onii-san Bizkitkid2001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tony_j15 View Post
    Doesn't have to be, but hardware independent gaming platform often means PC space, and that's already a crowded field with a lot more money that has to be sunk into development to ensure a quality experience across a range of hardware. Which is why consoles exist.

    Who says PC is a crowded space, and what does a "crowded space" actually mean? Developing games for the Xbox 360, Wii U, and PS3 cost a lot more money than developing a game for a PC. That is why Microsoft and Sony have decided to switch to x86 for their new consoles to make it easier for them to make games. Instead of a third party game developer making a PPC based game for the Xbox 360, a Cell based game for the PS3, and an x86 based game for the PC, they now just make an x86 based game and then tweak it to run on each piece of hardware.

    Right now as it is with consoles, the thing that makes Microsoft and Sony any profits are the sales of games, software, and services (Nintendo isn't making any profits off of their Wii U). It took Sony 4 years to start making any profit on the sales of PS3s. Sega use to be a console maker, but they did not like the idea of losing money trying to sell an expensive piece of hardware for cheap so they left the hardware side and continued to make games and released them on all the other consoles.

    Most games released today are cross-platform titles already. What differentiates between Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft are their first party exclusive.

    The three console companies could make a lot more money if they skipped the expensive proprietary box required to play their games and use their services. This is why the streaming service makes sense if it works. The companies can still sell their exclusive contents, which is what the company makes a majority of their profits from, yet the customer doesn't require a proprietary box for each service they want to use.

    I say that since it will be a very long time until a service like Onlive or Gaikai is good enough for the masses, a better and easier alternative for now would be to have one box that can run Nintendo, Microsoft, Sony, Steam, Origin, ect... services. Heck, if Microsoft, Nintendo and Sony wanted too, they could build their own Steam Boxes and put their first party games on Steam OS.
    Last edited by Bizkitkid2001; December 13th, 2013 at 03:35 PM.
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  12. #52
    AGW Trained Seal tony_j15's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bizkitkid2001 View Post
    Who says PC is a crowed space, and what does a "crowed space" actually mean?
    We're discussing platforms, it should be obvious and you mention several yourself at the end of your post.
    Steam, Origin, GameTap, Verdict, Green Man, and Direct 2 Drive are all in the PC platform space. The field is crowded.
    Microsoft is already in the space as well with Windows Market (and their status as both game retailer and OS developer is a topic deserving it's own thread).
    This thread itself is about SteamOS, which shows even Valve is aware the field is crowded and is attempting to extricate itself from having to rely on Microsoft.

    Most games released today are cross-platform titles already. What differentiates between Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft are their first party exclusive.
    The platform is also a differentiating factor. That would be the UI, the controller, the media that can be consumed via the device, etc. People prefer one over the other and tend to stick to it, just like Apple and Android phones. The platform is linked to the hardware. Sure, it can be delinked. But do we really want that?

    The three console companies could make a lot more money if they skipped the expensive proprietary box required to play their games and use their services.
    If that were true, they would do it. Since they aren't, I must assume the key people within the industry who have much more access to intelligence and bright minds have decided it is not profitable. And frankly, I don't think it passes the sniff test.

    This is why the streaming service makes sense if it works. The companies can still sell their exclusive contents, which is what the company makes a majority of their profits from, yet the customer doesn't require a proprietary box for each service they want to use.
    But it still requires a box and you've entirely eliminated the convenience factor.
    Why would I want to purchase a box from a third party or build it myself in order to then pay money to utilize a service when the efficacy of the box will always be in question? Well, I would if I'm a PC gamer.
    But for console folk? Why create the hassle?
    I would much rather buy a PS4 for $399 then give iBuyPower $500 for a box to then subscribe to Xbox Online for $20 a month.

    Heck, if Microsoft, Nintendo and Sony wanted too, they could build their own Steam Boxes and put their first party games on Steam OS.
    And if Apple wanted to, they could make Final Cut available on PC. It's a bad business decision. It subjugates your product and leaves you at the mercy of the platform, including their taking a cut of any additional sales made through the platform. That's fine for a developer, but not for a platform company (Apple, MS, Nintendo, Sony). Their goal is to be the big tent people come to. They are selling a curated experience, not just a game like a developer does.
    Valve has also realized they have become more of a tent than a mere developer, which is why they are trying to get out from under Microsoft's tent.

  13. #53
    Onii-san Bizkitkid2001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tony_j15 View Post
    We're discussing platforms, it should be obvious and you mention several yourself at the end of your post.
    Steam, Origin, GameTap, Verdict, Green Man, and Direct 2 Drive are all in the PC platform space. The field is crowded.
    Microsoft is already in the space as well with Windows Market (and their status as both game retailer and OS developer is a topic deserving it's own thread).
    Gametap, Verdict, Green Man, and D2D aren't platforms. They are retailers of digital games. Steam and Origin offer more services and social networking that lock their games into their wall-garden. You have to have Steam and Origin to play their games and access their services. Amazon sells physical and digital versions of PS3 games, yet Amazon isn't a gaming platform and it isn't required that you even have an Amazon account to play the games. Microsoft already has their Xbox Live platform tied in with PCs and mobile devices, so I don't see the problem with adding their console games to it.

    This thread itself is about SteamOS, which shows even Valve is aware the field is crowded and is attempting to extricate itself from having to rely on Microsoft.
    Just because Valve doesn't want to make gamers depend on an expensive OS to play their games does not mean that Valve is doing it because the field is crowed. Steam was created because of a LACK of a cohesive PC gaming platform that had all the features one would find on a console, and Steam OS is just an evolution of that same concept. Steam really has no competitor on that front. Origin is the closest thing, but Origin is geared to EA games. Name another PC platform that has as many features as Steam?


    The platform is also a differentiating factor. That would be the UI, the controller, the media that can be consumed via the device, etc. People prefer one over the other and tend to stick to it, just like Apple and Android phones. The platform is linked to the hardware. Sure, it can be delinked. But do we really want that?
    And these are all things that Sony and Microsoft could still have control over. They could create their own "Steam OS" that can be installed on any PC.


    If that were true, they would do it. Since they aren't, I must assume the key people within the industry who have much more access to intelligence and bright minds have decided it is not profitable. And frankly, I don't think it passes the sniff test.
    For all we know, they could already be working on that. This is a new concept. Even if Sony, Nintendo, and Microsoft are working on a PC platform, it will be years until we hear anything about this. Just because we haven't heard anything about this kind of shift happening does not mean it isn't going to happen and it also does not make it a bad idea.


    But it still requires a box and you've entirely eliminated the convenience factor.
    Because buying one cheap $50 box, like a Roku, to use a service like Online or Gaikai is better than spending several thousands of dollars buying multiple consoles and a gaming PC.

    Why would I want to purchase a box from a third party or build it myself in order to then pay money to utilize a service when the efficacy of the box will always be in question? Well, I would if I'm a PC gamer.
    But for console folk? Why create the hassle?
    What would the hassle be if you could use your already existing PC? If you have no PC, buying a cheap "box" that can play your games seems pretty convenient to me. A lot more convenient than the current way we play games.

    I would much rather buy a PS4 for $399 then give iBuyPower $500 for a box to then subscribe to Xbox Online for $20 a month.
    Except that people are already spending $500 for an X1 and then paying a monthly fee for Xbox Live. Or that people are already spending $400 for a PS4 and then paying a monthly fee for PS+.

    Wouldn't you rather spend $500 for a box and then pay a monthly fee for both Xbox Live and PS+, and then having the ability to play Xbox, Playstation, Nintendo, and PC games on that one box?


    And if Apple wanted to, they could make Final Cut available on PC. It's a bad business decision. It subjugates your product and leaves you at the mercy of the platform, including their taking a cut of any additional sales made through the platform. That's fine for a developer, but not for a platform company (Apple, MS, Nintendo, Sony). Their goal is to be the big tent people come to. They are selling a curated experience, not just a game like a developer does.
    Valve has also realized they have become more of a tent than a mere developer, which is why they are trying to get out from under Microsoft's tent.
    And how do you know that would happen? Microsoft Office and Windows are available on MAC and that didn't hurt them. Apple selling Final Cut for PC is no different than selling it for Mac. There is no one on the PC side taking a cut of their sales, except for the retailer but that already happens for any copy of Final Cut sold by someone other than Apple.

    Apple does not make Final Cut available for non-Apple products because they are using that as an incentive for consumers to buy a Mac. If you want Final Cut, you need a Mac. The difference with Apple and a console maker is that Apple makes money off of Mac sales. They aren't selling Macs at a loss and then hoping to recuperate that loss through the sale of software and services.
    Last edited by Bizkitkid2001; December 13th, 2013 at 06:34 PM.
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  14. #54
    ...Don't Mind Me... ShyguyXPC's Avatar
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    3/4's of the day has gone by and still waiting for the damned Download link to download the ISO of the OS to give it a try...

    Still no link on Steam, or the Steam OS Website.

  15. #55
    ...Don't Mind Me... ShyguyXPC's Avatar
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    What. The.. F*CK!!!...?


    SteamOS FAQ :: Steam Universe




    Q: What are the SteamOS Hardware Requirements?

    • Intel or AMD 64-bit capable processor
    • 4GB or more memory
    • 500GB or larger disk
    • NVIDIA graphics card (AMD and Intel graphics support coming soon)
    • UEFI boot support
    • USB port for installation



    4GB or More of Memory?

    500GB or more disk space?

    Only Nvidia support so far.


    UEFI boot support?


    So, basically for a lot of hardware from 3 years or older, won't be able to even run this early release?

    I don't think my Motherboard, any of them, are UEFI Supporting.

    I don't have a spare 500GB Drive to use.

    only 2GB RAM in my spare system.


    I thought this was supposed to be a slimmed down derivative of one of the Linux Distro's... why are these requirements so high (RAM, Drive space, 64-bit CPU, etc)







    On to installing.... YIKES!!!



    Q: How do I install SteamOS?
    There are two different install methods for SteamOS. '''WARNING: BOTH METHODS WILL ERASE EVERYTHING ON THE MACHINE'''

    The easiest method is an image-based install using CloneZilla. You will need to create a SteamOS System Restore USB stick to perform this install. The image provided here requires at least a 1TB disk.

    • Format a 4GB or larger USB stick with the FAT32 filesystem. Use "SYSRESTORE" as the partition name
    • Unzip the contents of SYSRESTORE.zip to this USB stick to create the System Restore USB stick
    • Put the System Restore USB stick in your target machine. Boot your machine and tell the BIOS to boot off the stick. (usually something like F8, F11 or F12 will bring up the BIOS boot menu).
    • Make sure you select the UEFI entry, it may look something like "UEFI: Patriot Memory PMAP"
    • Select "Restore Entire Disk" from the GRUB menu.
    • System Restore will proceed automatically. When it is complete it will reboot into your freshly re-imaged SteamOS

    The second method is based on the Debian Installer. It requires multiple configuration steps:

    • Unzip the SteamOSInstaller.zip file to a blank, FAT32-formatted USB stick.
    • Put the USB stick in your target machine. Boot your machine and tell the BIOS to boot off the stick. (usually something like F8, F11, or F12 will bring up the BIOS boot menu).
    • Make sure you select the UEFI entry, it may look something like "UEFI: Patriot Memory PMAP"
    • Pick "Automated Install" from the next menu.
    • The rest of the installation is unattended and will repartition the drive and install SteamOS.
    • After installation is complete, log onto the resulting system (using the Gnome session) with the predefined "steam" account. The password is "steam". Run steam, accept the EULA, and let it bootstrap. Logoff the steam account
    • Log on with the "desktop" account. The password is "desktop"
    • From a terminal window, run ~/post_logon.sh. This will prompt for a password - enter "desktop". This script will perform the post-install customizations, delete itself, then reboot into the recovery partition capture utility.
    • Confirm "y" to continue and the recovery partition will be created. When it is finished, reboot into your freshly installed SteamOS


    Seriously,,, the easiest method, image requires at least 1 TERABYTE of storage.... what the F happened to the 500GB or more requirement? If thats the case, then it should be 1TB or more.




    In either case, I may try to mess with this at some point, but right now, all I can say is WTF WTF WTF.... I hope this is not a sign of things to come, Valve, otherwise we're looking at replacing an Over Bloated, Under Performing OS and Platform, with yet just another over bloated, only slightly better performing one...

  16. #56
    ...Don't Mind Me... ShyguyXPC's Avatar
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    Download links for the Main Installer Zip File and the SysRestore Zip they talked about in the above FAQ (main installer is 960MB, the SysRestore is 2.4GB, so some HEFTY Downloads indeed)

    Index of /download

  17. #57
    Onii-san Bizkitkid2001's Avatar
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    Hopefully those are requirements for running the games as well. Maybe they are saying "If you want to install Steam OS and play some games, this is the minimum you need."

    EDIT: Or maybe they are purposely setting the requirements high to stop people from testing the OS on older machines. They may only want people to be using modern machines for beta testing so that there aren't people going "Man, this OS runs like crap on my 6 year old laptop!"
    Last edited by Bizkitkid2001; December 13th, 2013 at 10:22 PM.
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  18. #58
    Smile. It's easy. :) paul9's Avatar
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    I suppose it makes sense not to start with the requirements bar set too low. It isn't so much about cutting off older hardware (although there will be some of that), as enabling newer software and new games sales. Most of their top profit games would probably be the ones requiring better hardware. Also, people with older systems will install, and almost certainly be able to run it on lesser hardware, but some of the worst hardware would normally have the owners sending in complaints about performance levels to Steam. If they can point at those requirements, those unfair complaints should be nipped in the bud.
    Edit. Beaten by the Bizkit.
    Last edited by paul9; December 13th, 2013 at 10:27 PM.

  19. #59
    ...Don't Mind Me... ShyguyXPC's Avatar
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    All true, I can live with the 64-bit CPU, 4GB RAM, but the drive space requirements are what is absurd...

    500GB minimum?

    So, if a user only plays ONE game from Steam on Linux, they have to use a 500GB Drive, and have all that space go to waste?

    Some how, I find that hard to believe. And the one install method requiring a 1TB Drive.

    I currently only use a 750GB Drive for my Main Games drive, and I still have space to spare (245GB), with 88 Windows based Steam titles/games/programs installed.


    I know they probably have it set high to thin out the heard on testers, but then again, if thats the case, why even offer the download, just rely on the first 300 Steam Box Beta Testers, and at some later point when the OS is more polished, then release it to download and be used on regular systems..

    The Whole, Nvidia only thing is a bit of a joke as well, I can understand leaving out Intel, but they should have at least included some support for AMD GPU's as well.



    The only things keeping me from being able to test, if I abide by the Stated Requirements is the RAM and Drive Space, and of course the UEFI support, otherwise, I have a 64-bit capable CPU, and Nvidia GPU I can use.

    Which brings me to another question, given the stupidly high requirements, for whatever their reasons, then why vaguely state a 64-bit Intel or AMD CPU is needed...

    So, technically that requirement can be fulfilled by a really low end AMD APU with 64-bit support, or Intel Atom with 64-bit support.

    Or even AMD Single Core Sempron, with 64-bit support, or Intel Single Core Celeron with 64-bit support.

    If the goal was to weed out inferior, older, under performing hardware, in an effort to keep the complaints from those users down to a minimum, then why not specifically state a certain range of CPU from both camps.

    Granted with the AMD/Intel Low end CPU's or Single Cores, typically those will be paired with AMD or Intel Graphics, which ends up being a Double KO from the requirements, but a Low end AMD Sempron Single Core on Socket AM3, fulfills that CPU requirement, and can be paired with an Nvidia Card and everything else.

    Same with some low end Intel Dual Core Laptops with Hybrid Graphics, combining Intel Onboard and Nvidia "Optimus whatchamacallit" Graphics feature.


    Anyways, maybe I'll just pick up some cheap DDR2 another 2GB and a refurb 500GB or so HDD for cheap off newegg in a week or two and just toss those in to test with on that other rig I have.

  20. #60
    Onii-san Bizkitkid2001's Avatar
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    First try installing it. Maybe it will let you install it with less RAM and a smaller drive.

    As for why there is no AMD support right now, it is because Valve is working directly with AMD on making drivers for AMD cards and they don't have stable drivers yet.
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