New Build, New Graphics Card

[seb1234]

Hi there!

Building a new PC soon (2 weeks maybe?) and I'm having difficulty deciding on which card to chose! I prefer AMD, as I am a bit more familiar with them than the Nvidia ones.

The mobo i'm looking at is the ASUS M5A99X EVO AM3+ (Newegg.ca - ASUS M5A99X EVO AM3+ AMD 990X SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard with UEFI BIOS), installing 8 Gb of RAM, AMD Phenom II x4 black edition (3.4 Ghz) and a 650W PSU from corsair (TX650 V2).

I'd like the total cost of the built to be around 1000$ (pref a bit lower though), and without the graphic card it comes to around 760$. My brother proposed the Radeon HD 7850 2Gb at 265.99$, but price seems a little steep. MY goal with this PC is for work but also some gametime (BF3 high to ultra settings, some GW2 and maybe Far Cry 3)

In short, Three main questions:
1) Do you think this build can run the listed games well
2)Can the mobo support the card (I think the 7850 is PCI E 3.0 and the mobo only has 2.0?)
3) Any suggested modifications to the build?

Thanks for any and all help!
Cheers,
Seb

[ShyguyXPC]

ugh, really wish people knew more about PCIe, as we and others on other sites have been saying this for years, but PCI Express like USB and SATA are all backwards compatible with older slot spec cards, etc.

you can use 1.0 or 2.0 in a 3.0 slot, or 3.0 in a 1.0 or 2.0 slot.

The only limitations is some older first gen 2.0 cards had issues in some chipsets 1.0 slots. And of course top end 2.0 and 3.0 cards might be limited by 1.0's bandwidth.

But they will work fine.

As long as you have a x16 length and electrical slot, it will work, so your covered.


as to the card to get.

Well, the New Geforce GTX 660 Ti just came out yesterday, and its easily taking on the Radeon 7870 in performance and price, I would expect to see 7870 Prices drop some over the next couple months, along with the 7850 being pushed farther down to where it SHOULD be, as there is a huge price gap between it and the next step down 7770 series.

as to BF3 on High to Ultra settings, single player might be possible on the 7850, but multiplayer you'd want to something a bit higher end, 7870 at the very least, or Geforce GTX 660 Ti, or a reduced price Geforce GTX 580 (660 Ti vies for its performance spot at a lower price point as well as lower wattage usage and cooler temps).



One thing to also consider is holding off till October when AMD is releasing their Trinity Cores, basically the Next revision of their Current CPU's, the FX series.

There's no results really showing what they can do, but its expected to be better than the Flop that the FX series was. As well as having on the CPU, Radeon 7600 series GPU's, at least for the higher end Chips.

From what I have read it sounds like they're a mix of the current FX series, but using the newer Pile Driver Cores, and the Llanos APU platform.

what I've read so far is impressive, but I have yet to read any benchmark reviews or anything, since their not out yet.

These are the same CPU's that the new next gen Consoles are expected to be using, at least for the XBox 720, and possibly the new Nintendo Console.


Are you planning on running Dual Cards? if not, you could get a bit lesser PSU, like a Corsair 500-550W range unit (or Antec), and save a few bucks.



I'm not sure how your total comes to $760 with those 4 items not including the GPU, but I'm only showing about $400 total.

Newegg.ca - Antec NEO ECO 620C 620W Continuous Power ATX12V v2.3 / EPS12V 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply

Newegg.ca - ASUS M5A99X EVO AM3+ AMD 990X SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard with UEFI BIOS

Newegg.ca - CORSAIR Vengeance 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model CML8GX3M2A1600C9B

Newegg.ca - AMD Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition Deneb 3.4GHz Socket AM3 125W Quad-Core Processor HDZ965FBGMBOX

$365 or so.

The Antec has a 15% off Promo code good to the 23rd so that drops the price even more.

Its a 620W rated unit, 48A +12V Rail, the Corsair you were looking at is 650W Rated, 53A Rail, and cost quite a bit more.

I don't have anything against the Corsair PSU, I have a first gen TX750 unit, that still goes strong, but in order to get the GPU performance you want, you'll want to cut corners in costs with out sacrificing quality as well.

that Antec would be more than capable of Running the rig with Dual 7870's if you wanted.

and Dual 7850's would easily be handled by it.




For just under a grand...

Newegg.ca - LG DVD Burner 24X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 8X DVD+R DL 24X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 32X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM Black SATA Model GH24NS90 - CD / DVD Burners

Newegg.ca - COOLER MASTER Elite 430 RC-430-KWN1 Black Steel / Plastic Computer Case

Newegg.ca - Antec NEO ECO 620C 620W Continuous Power ATX12V v2.3 / EPS12V 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply

Newegg.ca - Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium SP1 64-bit - Operating Systems

Newegg.ca - Seagate Barracuda ST1000DM003 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive

Newegg.ca - ASUS M5A99X EVO AM3+ AMD 990X SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard with UEFI BIOS

Newegg.ca - PowerColor PCS+ AX7850 2GBD5-2DHPP Radeon HD 7850 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card

Newegg.ca - CORSAIR Vengeance 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model CML8GX3M2A1600C9B

Newegg.ca - AMD Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition Deneb 3.4GHz Socket AM3 125W Quad-Core Processor HDZ965FBGMBOX

Newegg.ca - Corsair Force Series 3 CSSD-F60GB3A-BK 2.5" 60GB SATA III Internal Solid State Drive (SSD)



aside from an aftermarket CPU Cooler if you wanted to OC that CPU, that would be another $30 or so for a decent cooler.

Lacks Keyboard/Mouse/Monitor, and Speakers, but assuming you can reuse what you currently have now to save some funds.

[seb1234]

Thanks for the very thorough reply haha!

yeah, the 760$ included other parts which I hadn't mentioned, so here is the full list of what i'm looking at :

Newegg.ca - Rosewill BLACKHAWK Gaming ATX Mid Tower Computer Case, come with Five Fans, window side panel, top HDD dock

Newegg.ca - ASUS M5A99X EVO AM3+ AMD 990X SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard with UEFI BIOS

Newegg.ca - Rosewill RNX-N180UBE Wireless Adapter IEEE 802.11b/g/n USB 2.0 1T2R / 5 dBi External Antenna / Up to 300Mbps Wireless Download Data Rates 64/128-bit WEP (Hex & ASCII), WPA/WPA2, WPA(TKIP with IEEE 8

Newegg.ca - Antec NEO ECO 620C 620W Continuous Power ATX12V v2.3 / EPS12V 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply

Newegg.ca - Western Digital Caviar Blue WD5000AAKX 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive

Newegg.ca - G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model F3-12800CL9D-8GBRL

Newegg.ca - AMD Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition Deneb 3.4GHz Socket AM3 125W Quad-Core Processor HDZ965FBGMBOX

Newegg.ca - COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 EVO RR-212E-20PK-R2 Continuous Direct Contact 120mm Sleeve CPU Cooler Compatible with latest Intel 2011/1366/1155 and AMD FM1/AM3+

Newegg.ca - ADATA S510 Series AS510S3-120GM-O 2.5" 120GB SATA III MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) - Internal SSD


As for crossfire/SLI I have no intention of running it, too expensive for me :P ! Getting Windows from a friend of mine who has a spare copy and gonna reuse the DVD drive from my current PC.

The GTX 660ti seems very impressive, but I find the price point a bit high at around the 300$ mark. As for the 580 i'm assuming you can extrapolate my response !!

I've looked into 5 potential cards at a 200-275$ budget, really liking the GTX 480 but the heat seems to be a bit of an issue (and I wouldn't be getting a gpu cooling unit)

Newegg.ca - EVGA 015-P3-1480-KR GeForce GTX 480 (Fermi) 1536MB 384-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card

Newegg.ca - EVGA 012-P3-1570-AR GeForce GTX 570 (Fermi) 1280MB 320-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card

Newegg.ca - XFX Double D HD-695X-CDFC Radeon HD 6950 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card with Eyefinity

Newegg.com - SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 6870 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card (100314-3L )

Newegg.ca - PowerColor PCS+ AX7850 2GBD5-2DHPP Radeon HD 7850 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card

They all seem capable of running BF3 at high-ultra settings (also putting into consideration I have one monitor, 21" 1680x1050) However I may look into upgrading to a better monitor within the coming years (or maybe even dual monitors)

In particular with the GTX 480, would you think that the fans pre-installed on the case would be sufficient to keep it cool? should I install more case fans?

Thanks again!

[ShyguyXPC]

If your not going Dual cards, then you don't need that Motherboard really, nor do you need the 620W PSU, the 520W Antec would be enough.



Thing is, with the 480, though its a good card, and price is cheaper, its been out for a couple years now, its OLD, what I was commenting with the 580 (even if its Refurbished Cheaper models), is that it is newer, a bit better. If you have the budget now, why not get something better that you won't have to upgrade down the road sooner with.

If you can cut costs like the OS, a cheaper Mobo, etc, then I'd honestly spring for a $400 GTX 670 at the least, or the AMD Radeon 7950/7970 cards.

get as much GPU as you can, now, to stave off any upgrades down the road in coming years. I know some of these lesser ones can run BF3 at higher settings fine, but like most of us gamers, we don't stick just to ONE game over the course of the PC's life, find we like some others, and if we limited our upgrade route, find our selves spending even MORE money on upgrades to run the game we want sooner than we had liked.

SoloCamo here, has a 480, has it overclocked to GTX 580 performance, but he picked up the card cheap, and has had luck with OCing it.


I mean the logic isn't exactly there, not willing to spend much more than $300 tops for a GPU, but yet, your nabbing an SLI/Crossfire capable Motherboard with no intentions of ever going that route?

its extra money being wasted on the board, and not GPU.

At the LEAST, I'd upgrade that HDD, depending on what you do on the PC and how many games you play, you'll find 500GB doesn't go as far as it used to. I'd be looking at no less than a 640-750GB Drive at the least, 1TB or so recommended.

Seagate like the one I linked, or Western Digitals Black series, for the speed/performance. The Blue series are ok, but their just average speed drives.

Change out the PSU, HDD and Mobo with these and you save $5, but its still savings and not spending on parts/performance/features you won't need.


Newegg.ca - Antec NEO ECO 520C 520W Continuous Power ATX12V v2.3 / EPS12V 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply

Newegg.ca - Seagate Barracuda ST1000DM003 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive

Newegg.ca - GIGABYTE GA-970A-UD3 AM3+ AMD 970 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard

HDD is double the WD you listed, slimmer due to storing more data on the platter, features 1GB of storage per platter so its a single platter, less search time needed to find data, 64MB Cache memory, so four times the buffer size, should be much faster than the Blue Series, and double the storage.

Mobo, still has OCing options, decent cooling sinks, is Crossfire only which is pretty much stock on most AMD boards, still has USB 3.0 and SATA 3 ports, costs a bit less.

PSU is still plenty for the whole rig with a single card. (Also has a 15% off promo code for the unit, so your saving a bit more than $5 off the total cart price).

The case is nice, but you could save a bit more with one of the cheaper $50 range cases, which are still more than suitable for the system.

that would easily knock $30-40 off the price list and can be devoted to the GPU, making it possible to nab a GTX 470 or Radeon 7950 and call it a day.

to be honest if it were me, I'd consider the 7950, with 3GB of RAM, and a 384-bit memory bus, the card should be MUCH better in BF3 than some of the cards you listed, BF3 can really eat up a lot of memory space and bus bit rate.

helps smooth things out on higher settings like Micro stutter and other things.

Would be a good choice: Newegg.ca - MSI R7950 Twin Frozr 3GD5/OC Radeon HD 7950 3GB 384-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card




$985

Newegg.ca - GIGABYTE GA-970A-UD3 AM3+ AMD 970 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard

Newegg.ca - ADATA S510 Series AS510S3-120GM-O 2.5" 120GB SATA III MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) - Internal SSD

Newegg.ca - AMD Phenom II X4 965 Black Edition Deneb 3.4GHz Socket AM3 125W Quad-Core Processor HDZ965FBGMBOX

Newegg.ca - G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model F3-12800CL9D-8GBRL

Newegg.ca - MSI R7950 Twin Frozr 3GD5/OC Radeon HD 7950 3GB 384-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card

Newegg.ca - Seagate Barracuda ST1000DM003 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive

Newegg.ca - Antec NEO ECO 520C 520W Continuous Power ATX12V v2.3 / EPS12V 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply

Newegg.ca - Rosewill RNX-N180UBE Wireless Adapter IEEE 802.11b/g/n USB 2.0 1T2R / 5 dBi External Antenna / Up to 300Mbps Wireless Download Data Rates 64/128-bit WEP (Hex & ASCII), WPA/WPA2, WPA(TKIP with IEEE 8

Newegg.ca - Rosewill BLACKHAWK Gaming ATX Mid Tower Computer Case, come with Five Fans, window side panel, top HDD dock




$997 with these changes.

Newegg.ca - OCZ Vertex 3 VTX3-25SAT3-90G 2.5" 90GB SATA III MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD)

Newegg.ca - XIGMATEK Gaia SD1283 120mm Long Life Bearing CPU Cooler bracket included LGA 2011 i7 i5 775 1155 AMD and dual fan push pull compatible

SSD is 90GB, still enough room for the OS and a few apps, Windows 7 usually grows to around 40-60GB total in size after a little usage for a few months.

Install the games and other software and Windows Swap file on the 1TB and you'd be fine.

This isn't factoring in shipping, but its nearing your budget max with out skimping too much, a bit more rounded out from your list, and nets you a GPU that should last much longer than the sub $300 models your looking at.

At the very least I would consider an AMD Radeon HD 7870, or Geforce GTX 660 Ti though.

Newegg.ca - MSI R7870 Twin Frozr 2GD5/OC Radeon HD 7870 GHz Edition 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card

Newegg.ca - Computer Hardware, Video Cards & Video Devices, Desktop Graphics Cards, GeForce GTX 600 series, 3GB

but at that upper price range the 7950 would be the better one. Powercolor has a nice 7870 OC'd the snot out of, but its priced $20 more than the 7950, but I know that card performs at or just above a 7950 despite being a class lower card.



But the 7870 like the one linked above, or this GTX 570 Newegg.ca - EVGA 025-P3-1579-AR GeForce GTX 570 (Fermi) HD 2560MB 320-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card

Would be your best bets for the $300 or lower range, with the greater memory size and Bus width for BF3.



Another option, though hit or miss with this card, as some have had problems with the cards not working after a while, but it would be a definite possibility.

GTX 580/GTX 660 Ti performance for the 660 Ti's price.

Newegg.ca - EVGA 02G-P3-1387-AR GeForce GTX 460 (Fermi) 2Win 2GB 512-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready Video Card

Its Dual GTX 460 1GB Chips on a single card run in SLI on the card. So no SLI mobo needed. though it eats up a good chunk of power and a better PSU would be needed, but at $50 less than the 7950, it'd be easily enough to put that 620W Antec in there.

even throw in the CM 212+ EVO cooler back in the list.


If you HAD to get a sub $300 card, the Radeon 6950 2GB, or Radeon 7850 2GB would be the choices then.

Newegg.ca - Computer Hardware, Video Cards & Video Devices, Desktop Graphics Cards, Radeon HD 6000 series, Radeon HD 6950, 2GB

Preferably due to the slight OC: Newegg.ca - MSI R6950 Twin Frozr II OC Radeon HD 6950 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card with Eyefinity



This would be my best choice for under $300 though: Newegg.ca - PowerColor PCS+ AX7850 2GBD5-2DHPP Radeon HD 7850 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card

Due to its high Factory OC of 1GHz, when stock clocks are 860.



Taking you list above, and putting the Gigabyte Mobo and Powercolor 7850 in it:

Newegg.ca - GIGABYTE GA-970A-UD3 AM3+ AMD 970 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard

Newegg.ca - PowerColor PCS+ AX7850 2GBD5-2DHPP Radeon HD 7850 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card

Replace the WD Blue HDD with the seagate, Newegg.ca - Seagate Barracuda ST1000DM003 1TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive

total before shipping comes to just under $946.

Not factoring in Promo codes either.

The 7850 at those clock speeds should easily be as good as a 7870, or even in some games get close to 7950 range. Especially since the cards voltage is bumped from a stock 7850, as one reviewer was able to nudge out an extra 200Mhz out of the card, which would easily bring it into 7950 range performance.