When is Bush going to shut down the southern border ???

[Gomer]

secure border = dead aliens

[pickel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hungrycookpot

show me some freaking statistics please before you cry out for "justice" with your claims of mexicans slaughtering and killing us like cattle. Exactly how many illegal immigrant-caused fatal car accident are there per year? This seems like some pretty thinly veiled BULLS**T you have made up to justify your racism.

I never said it was okay to let illegal immigrants come into the US as they feel fit, but to speak about murdering them if they try? Thats disgusting.

TRB, im sure its not that easy, or they would perhaps do that, instead of leaving their homes with only what they can carry, risking arrest and jail to try and get here to work as a minimum wage laborer? Most likely it costs alot of money to register for a green card and take the tests and just to be accepted really, money that these people just dont have, and have no way of getting. I don't think you guys realize that they arent just doing this for sh**s and giggles, these are people trying to survive.

OK, you got me on this one. Let me make myself perfectly clear. To show I'm not prejudiced. To show you I'm not partisan. To show you I'm fairminded and have a heart of Gold. I donot care where these people come from or where they're going as long as they stay out on MY country without going thru the proper channels. Even if was only these two unfortunate indiviuals, that was two too many.

[Chuckiechan]

The Mexicans are not the problem! Mexico is!

[Toadman]

I agree with Chuck. It's not a true Democracy. There's unbridled decades of corruption/kick-backs to those in power and it's not the populace's fault. They're good hard-working people(and fun) overall and I understand their wants for a better life like the Euro immigrants to the USA. The problem is rotting from within their gov't and it's unfortunate the US has to take such extreme measures to protect it's own. 9/11 only exacerbated the problem and the stubborn leadership on both sides still exists.

[dday]

Man, this is a really sensitive issue. I can see it has really started a row.
1st, I live on the border in San Diego, Ca. and I have watched this sad movie replay everyday for nearly 40 yrs. . I'm all for people coming here and making a good life for their families and loved ones. But use the rule book and get in line and take a number.
The current Bush non-policy is to say we're going to tighten the border up and add a bunch of new people and tighten access at the check points, which has forced illlegals to move farther into the deserts,ie, Arizona, New Mexico, Imperial Valley area of Ca. . The added bodies at the gates has slowed the tide some but only at he ports of entry, the current non-enforcement and non-cooperation of local and federal law enforcement doesn't allow sweeps outside of the border zone. Border Patrol has their hands tied from Wa. DC,( got this info. from my neighbor a Border Patrol supervisor) and the local cops have no directive allowing them to enforce immigration law and fear of law suits has all but curtailed local police from getting involved. All that messy discrimination stuff scares the local cops off.
As far as the current political season goes, nobody running for election is going to push immigration issues during the campaign season. Maybe later but not now.
The net effect on the economy is that the current illegal population is staying because another amnesty program might well be on the way. The Bush camp does not call it that, but in essence that is what it will be. This stance actually has caused a greater influx from illegals this year because the current Bush admin. has allowed the inference to stand.
My only real worry is that there have been "unconfirmed reports" of Middle Eastern and possibly Chechen fighters coming into the country from Arizona and Texas. NICE !!!
I'm a Bush supporter on most issues, but I'm not behind him on this issue. We have dropped the ball on this one far too long. We need to coordinate the locals and the feds and re-implement sweeps in areas outside of the border zones. But this will cause the larger employers to scream, no workers, no lettuce or tomatoes, prices go up, things get economically messy.
As far as shooting folks from towers, WHAT ARE YOU CRAZY!!!????
Just 3 or 4 yrs. ago a mexican national kid(teenager) was shot and killed by US troops either in Arizona or New Mexico, right on the border. He supposedly or apparently pointed a gun at these guys and they took him out. This is a real story, and it caused all kinds of trouble.
I like most of you here, but the racist stuff isn't going to fly!!
Let's have some real ideas here folks.

[Epidemic]

Illegal aliens steal jobs and reduce legal imigrant quotas.

3 million illegal aliens come to america and spend thousands of dollars to do so. They end up paying off their debt in virtual slavery.

Stop illegal immigration and business will force increases in legal quotas. We will still see 3 million come in (thereabouts) but it will be controlled with names photo's and background checks. I feel sorry bout their lot in life in mexico or wherever they come from. But illegal is not good for anyone in the long run.

I would demand business collect information from all their employees to prove citizenship, any company who violated this should be fined within an inch of their existence.

This would do several things:

1) fines would drive wages up to legal market value (removing business's ability use immigration status to screw the employee [remove slavery status])
2) restrict public services (no welfare, no education for children of illegals, no medical care without a bus ticket to the border)
3) Increase border patrol to about 60,000 and additionally deploy them with helicopters and rapid response teams so that no section of the border would be unpatrolled for more than say 30 minutes at a clip.
4) Clarify citizenship rules to state clearly that children of illegals are illegal as well. The only method for citizenship should be to naturalized americans or born americans.

This would:
Make the lot in life for the illegal worse then back home and hence would virtually dry up illegal immigration.

Business would demand immigration caps be raised to proper levels but evenly distributed.

Reduce load on public school system.

Reduce load on law enforcement and prison system by controling who enters america and paying them a fair wage.

Leaving the borders open:

provides incentive to risk life (costing hundreds of lives a year)

allows business to exploit status to maintain virtual slavery and sweat shops. This creates artificially high rates of crime to make up the difference.

Artificial low wages and lack of taxes paid leave education support as the responsibility of other americans. In other words they are not pulling their weight financially.

The list goes on.......

[washe]

Well at least you options are more sensitive than sweeping the borders....

In the past there was a pact between the two nations, where Mexico provided the worforce and USA provided shelter and workplaces, they worked around 6 months there and then reissued a permit to keep working.

The should make another program like this one, where they can control, who, whom, where and what.

Who = Company that makes the contract
Whom = Individual with legal papers
Where = City, State where it will be working
What = Activity the indivual will be doing on that time.

[Chuckiechan]

Washe:

What is wrong with Mexico?

[Epidemic]

Thanks for reminding me

One of the biggest benefits I forgot all about is the fact that we (the USA) act as a pressure valve allowing the scumm who rob and pilliage mexico to maintain power. if all the unhappy people were forced to remain there would be a greater political and physical force acting in mexico to effect change.

Mexico has problems and their go getters are all moving out of their country because it is run by a corrupt system. If forced to say due to no jobs, benefits... in the USA then they would be a force to recon with.

[washe]

Apart for the well know problem of the distristribution of the economic at hand of a few people.

That we have the most retarded President in the history as a nation.
We need to change a lot of things but stills oour goverment lacks the power and the will to change, the corruption is one of the biggest and abismal problems we have, altought times are changing, people are not happy with the current status now the ask for accountability of the goverment, the society awareness and culture is growing, right now Mexico has now as a lot of young people in a possible economic age around 65% is around 18-34, but the fact there is not enough jobs creates this inmigration problem, and also rises crime, etc, etc.

Right now a lot of us is working to change the disposition the global word has about the Mexican, it will be harsh road for us, but at least I work and expect to give a better country for the coming generations.

In Mexico existed 4 social classes Very poor, poor, Medium and High...

Right now as broken in 3.... Extremely poor, poor and High...

Where Medium class is being hitted very hard, becuase you earn enough to live decent but you dont have enough to capitalize and get more wealth, leaving you a bit unproctected when you reach 50-60 years.
Education is one of the biggest concerns you can hit the border and the education level is high but if you go to the lower parts it begin to degrade to elementary school.

The list can keep on, but one thing is sure we are changing and evolving, we are working hard for it and the changes required will need to start soon.... or I fear there will be another revolution..