what is religion?

[no1_vern]

I dont really know how you came up with those choices. The best description of religion is a formalized belief sys tem. It could be said to be a strong belief set up in a formalized manner for the worship of something, a concept or a deity.

Wiki is WAY to wordy:

Quote:

Religion is a system of social coherence based on a common group of beliefs or attitudes concerning an object, person, unseen being, or system of thought considered to be supernatural, sacred, divine or highest truth, and the moral codes, practices, values, institutions, and rituals associated with such belief or system of thought.

"social coherance"?? O-kay I guess it could be described that way.

BTW: a "sy stem of thought" being considered a religion?? Sounds like atheism to me.

[-FMA]

Yep, Vern has it right. That's how I would define religion, if I had to in a more formal way. I still like my way of saying it:

"Religion is a cult, but with magical worlds and super hero's"

[BBA]

Epi...You forgot a few choices, like a belief in something that IS everything as a diety.

Or, religion is a formallized or organized expression of a belief.

Why are you preoccupied with this 'in the sky' crap? You limit yourself by such narrow thinking.

[Epidemic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cyphen

It seems that the non-religious and particularly the anti-religious tend to characterize and demean the religious as believing in silly magical beings...

why is that? where does that arrogance come from? What makes you think God uses "magical" powers??? I've long held the belief that nothing supernatural exists.... meaning that everything that exists is natural. Indeed, many of the things you might think of as supernatural - miracles in the bible - are far from it. Think for instance of parting the red sea.... magical god powers, right? Something supernatural, right? Why would God, who created everything including nature, need to use anything other than that which he created??

How did god part the red sea according to the bible? A strong westerly wind that blew all night...

it's the lack of understanding (or desire to understand) on the part of those mischaracterizing it that gives them this view.

If someone from 31 A.D. were to see us do something as simple as walking into a supermarket, they might think we were wizards... "he can command the very doors of the buildings to open at his bidding!!!"

Well magical meaning beyond natural explaination and experience of virtually everyone alive today. No one has seen a man re-attach an ear simply by placing his hand upon it. (magic) No one has seen a person feed 5000 people with a bottomless single basket of fish (magic). Walking on water again no one has seen such a thing (really since historical recording process was improved by the printing press) Lets not leave out the jews magic (temple curtain where priests teleported in the holiest of holies) or old testament women turned into salt.

For the above examples the only explainations would include 1) fiction, 2) Magic, 3)trickery (no westerly wind will raise the dead, re-attach ears or make the finite volume of a basket larger on the inside than outside)

Quote:

If someone from 31 A.D. were to see us do something as simple as walking into a supermarket, they might think we were wizards... "he can command the very doors of the buildings to open at his bidding!!!"

[clancy]

For some reason this thread made me think of this from one of Kurt Vonnegut's books

Tiger got to hunt
Bird got to fly
Man got to sit and wonder, “Why, why, why?”
Tiger got to sleep
Bird got to land
Man got to tell himself he understands.

[osprey4]

Regardless of what they say or how narrowly they define religion, the atheist, agnostic or self-described "non-religious" hold a metaphysical world view characterized by presuppositions, postulates and prejudices. Such a world view is just as "faith-based" as those who hold a theistic world view.

[Beemer]

My presupposition is not changed due to claims of the metaphysical which don't hold water in any remotely empiracal sense. Your claim of there being a god is scene to be wholey irrelevant until proven otherwise.

Religion has to realise that faith and belief are not solely religious terms.

I have faith in my presupposition that there is not a tooth fairy. Does this faith become a religion as well?

Present a challenge at least.

[osprey4]

The non-existance of the tooth fairy is not a presupposition but a conclusion based on your world view. Your presupposition and conclusion would be something like:
The material world that I see and live in is all that there is. There is no realm of reality of a non-material, i.e., spiritual nature. God, if he were to exist, can exist only in a spiritual world. Therefore, he does not exist.

This is the basic presupposition of a mechanistic or "reductionist" philosophy.

[Beemer]

Quote:

The non-existance of the tooth fairy is not a presupposition but a conclusion based on your world view.

I caught my father lifting my pillow. Presupposition based on experience.

Someone of religion giving relevance to any brand of reductionism? lol

How about "greedy reductionism" and religion for $500 Alex.

You may want to apply a little reductionism to your example as it reads to much into your argument.

Another way to fix it would be to add the word supposed before spiritual world to be fair.

Why would I also presuppose a spiratual world exists in discerning relevance of an existing god? You seem to be compounding the argument by further introducing items in your belief system, or on another argument that includes details of where the god exists as well as if it exists.

I think you're bordering on an argument from infinite digression trying to break me down so that when I give up it seems you win the debate.

There is another way to look at it though. I got tired of being baffled by bull poop.

I in know way live my life based on my disbelief in a god. It isn't a philosophy anymore than the disbelief in a tooth fairy.

The end.

[jokostel]

a religion is some yahoo's word for a large cult.

however there is NOTHING wrong with a belief or an idea that something exists...
and working to better yourself/family/mankind..