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  1. #1
    OAP Theophylact's Avatar
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    Thumbs down Insulting religion

    You know, I get accused of being against religion for posting news items in which members of one faith or another, acting badly, gave their beliefs as reasons for their stupid, vicious or bigoted behavior. But it's their violation of the tenets of their religions that I'm pointing out, not any problems with the religions themselves.

    Now we have a bunch of threads (I won't even bother to point them out) in which totally uninformed people are sounding off about the deficiencies or absurdities of other people's religions.

    If a Jew were to mock the Christian notions of the Trinity, the Virgin Birth, the Resurrection, or Transsubstantiation in the kind of language that's being used here, he'd be cut off shorter than a bris.

    You guys should be ashamed of yourselves.

  2. #2
    Senior Member J-Excel's Avatar
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    I've seen a few people doing as you; pointing out vicious and bigoted behavior in violation of the tenets of the particular religion being discussed. For example, the couple of "72 virgins" threads. In this example the person here that is most familiar with Islam, ClubMed, has done a very good job of pointing out that anyone preaching or believing in the "72 virgins" reward is misguided, and that it is entirely possible that the entire concept of the "72 virgins" reward is a misinterpretation made by westerners unfamiliar with the Muslim religion and Arab culture. But I haven't seen any attacks on the tenets of any religions. Maybe I just haven't noticed.

    EDIT: Or maybe I have done this without thinking. I've defended evolution from fundamentalists, and in doing so I've stated more than once that a literal translation of the biblical creation story is unbelievable.
    Last edited by J-Excel; October 30th, 2003 at 12:28 PM.

  3. #3
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    nah, people here mock Christianity all day long every day, lol...I doubt anyone would be cut off....maybe just ignored for unoriginality.

    And just speaking generally....I a person posts things regularly that show a certain subject in a bad light..or if they seem to delight in trying to point ridicule at that subject...I think most people would say that person is "against" the subject, lol....not really a stretch there to see that much.

    And Im not sure about others here...but I dont shudder and shake with respect about "NEWS ITEMS"..as if they are in any way relating to fact or reality....just because its in the news means...nothing, lol.

    For "news items" one might substitute the words

    "drivel"
    "hype"
    "propoganda"
    "lies"

    I always laff that the ones AGAINST religion are the main ones posting ABOUT religion....which is pretty absurd.

    Think about it....if a person feels a subject is worthless or without merit...how much MORE WORTHLESS is it for that person to be posting about it ad infinitum, lol......cracks me up.

    Besides that....people who are pros at pointing out shortcomings etc...that sort of speaks volumes........any child can look at something and find fault...that doesnt really require any special insight.

    So what I always wonder is this......the people that are soooooo ggoooooooddddd at showing us whats wrong...WHY DONT THEY EVER SHOW US WHATS RIGHT???????

    lol, hilarious.

    JP
    "Even a fool is thought to be wise if he is silent"

  4. #4
    Banned shahani's Avatar
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    I concur fully, Theo.

    I think some people are religious fanatics/zealots and can't help but attack anyone who doesn't think like them.

    Oh well.

  5. #5
    Si vis pacem, para bellum daveleau's Avatar
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    You can discuss religion without being indignant about your beliefs. Indignation is what pushes people away and makes people think you are trying to be in their face. This has led to the mere mentioning of religion as repulsing people. This is very sad, and unfortunately very prevalent. Hopefully the pendulum will swing back as it has in the past. Only time till tell. I think many religious leaders focus on the negative because of what is going on in today's world. This has spawned anything from those that JP speaks of above to murderous terrorists.

    Many religions teach that they are the only correct religion. It is up to us to find what is correct and believe what we think is correct. Some religions teach proselytizing to save as many as possible (Christianity, Islam and Hindu); others do not (Judaism and Buddhism). You can debate religion and talk about it without yelling and screaming that one is right and the other is wrong.

    Personally, I would be very pleased if someone called me a religious fanatic. I wish I was more devoted than I am and am constantly working to become more devoted, as most truly religious people do.

  6. #6
    Banned shahani's Avatar
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    Good post, Dave.

    Once again I am impressed with your self-discipline and sense of perspective.

  7. #7
    Banned Optimus Prime's Avatar
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    John Prophet, see, i know a LOT about religion, and THATS why i hate it. How can you hate something you KNOW NOTHING ABOUT?

    To hate it, or to like it, you must learn about it. I have, and I've made up my choice, it sucks big time.

  8. #8
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    Well, I dont think I said anything about KNOWING being bad, lol..its the RANTING on and on part......I mean, I hate spinach..but Ill be danged if Ill get up here and cry about it in 20 posts a day, lol...stating facts and showing news tidbits trying to prove all spinach eaters are nuts, lol.
    "Even a fool is thought to be wise if he is silent"

  9. #9
    Banned shahani's Avatar
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    Spinach is good fer you.

  10. #10
    IC
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    The ORIGINAL Trinity was composed of Atum, Shu & Tefnut. This covers both of the scientific aspects of 1. The atomic science of Creation, and 2. Human biology, as well as describing the matrimonial state.

    The beauty of it is, that it is VERY SIMPLE and easy to understand.

    Rather than being a "religion" it is more a statement of scientific and biological FACT.

    It is also a FACT that this is where "belief" stems from. i.e. Egypt is where YOUR belief should come from.

    Whilst it may appear that the Egyptians had many "gods" these were, in fact, deified aspects of how religion ACTUALLY works.

    In FACT the Egyptians only recognised ONE GOD CREATOR, just as everyone else is supposed to do, whose name is Ptah.

    Ptah = Pater = Father.

    You don't need religion, as such, to know that, all you need is science and learning.

    By contrast, I find the notion of "holiness" to be insulting to everyone.
    Last edited by IC; October 30th, 2003 at 02:14 PM.

  11. #11
    IC
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    Thread Crap Deleted

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  12. #12
    Ultimate Member osprey4's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Optimus Prime
    John Prophet, see, i know a LOT about religion, and THATS why i hate it. How can you hate something you KNOW NOTHING ABOUT?

    To hate it, or to like it, you must learn about it. I have, and I've made up my choice, it sucks big time.
    Here is an example of the sort of arrogance religious people are accused of, just so everyone understands it's not just "religious fanatics/zealots" who are intolerant.

  13. #13
    Banned Optimus Prime's Avatar
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    intolerant? Haha, you damn right i am, the only reason religion was made was to get money of the peasants. Sux2bthem don't it?

    This is my opinion, agree with it, disagree with it, I don't care, i'll act like an ignorant religious person myself and disregard anything anyone says to swerve my POV.
    Last edited by Optimus Prime; October 30th, 2003 at 02:54 PM.

  14. #14
    Banned wallie_x's Avatar
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    shahani sez:
    "I think some people are religious fanatics/zealots and can't help but attack anyone who doesn't think like them."
    Look who's talking! The only thing I've heard come out of you is a bunch of ad hominem drivel against people who think differently than you. No sound logic, no sound reasoning, just petty one-line attacks like your quote.

  15. #15
    Banned shahani's Avatar
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    I was referring, inter alia to myself.

  16. #16
    Banned wallie_x's Avatar
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    Bailiff open up the can that contains the worms!!

  17. #17
    Banned shahani's Avatar
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  18. #18
    MR Meek and Mild Epidemic's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Optimus Prime
    intolerant? Haha, you damn right i am, the only reason religion was made was to get money of the peasants. Sux2bthem don't it?

    This is my opinion, agree with it, disagree with it, I don't care, i'll act like an ignorant religious person myself and disregard anything anyone says to swerve my POV.
    I might agree with this except for one thing. I believe that the followers including the spiritual leaders actually believe the stuff. So for what ever reason reson religion was created by God, or by man for power, the pope actually believes that being Celibate is a requirement to get nearer to god and that tything is gods will and moneys the church collect are not for partying.

    Some of the televangilists don't live the life of poverty and I suspect some them do not have motives hewn from a love of their god.

  19. #19
    Banned Optimus Prime's Avatar
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    Yeah, just to point out lads, that i do actually believe in God, but just not religion, i think it's really quite bad.

  20. #20
    Si vis pacem, para bellum daveleau's Avatar
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    Interesting. I used to feel this way when I was younger. Then I found the right church and I realized that your personal relationship with God can't grow without the church. that's what I found. If it is the truth (and I believe wholeheartedly that it is because of the source), then I hope that you find that same truth.

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