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  • January 10th, 2012, 11:06 AM
    Chuckiechan
    The whole idea is to "not miss". If the perp dies, he dies.

    And Creatures, if the perp is far enough away that you have time to aim, chances are he's far enough away that you may find yourself in trouble.
  • January 10th, 2012, 08:29 AM
    Dude111
    Im glad she is ok
  • January 9th, 2012, 11:21 AM
    Epidemic
    I think the attacks on Creatures are un-called for in this thread.

    He is pretty consistent with his belief that people should never be killed no matter what. I simply do not believe the same thing. And I am glad that most people seem to support what this woman did.

    But Creatures is certainly allowed to have his morals and opinions. even if they are wrong
  • January 8th, 2012, 03:46 PM
    Taxmancometh
    Quote Originally Posted by pickel View Post
    4. Create a home invasion panic room at the center of your home, with a deadbolt lock, sturdy door, first aid supplies, and a charged cell phone. Home invaders often cut the phone lines to prevent you from calling for help. Keeping a cell phone in your panic room allows you to call for help if the regular lines of communication are cut. Use a strip of tape...write your address on it and stick it next to your phone...in a panic you may not be able to remember it. Keep a flashlight nearby.
    I'd also recommend a chain lock and don't use the screws that come with it but rather larger heavy duty screws. Trust me, from watching mythbusters try to break into a door like this it won't happen. I have one for the garage door.
  • January 8th, 2012, 10:50 AM
    pickel

    Are you Ready ????

    Quote Originally Posted by Creatures View Post
    I admit the distances are bit short for trying to wound with a pistol or assault rifle, but a shotgun to the legs should be sufficient to stop him from charging.

    But the overall agreement was dead men don't tell tales and that's pretty much what I think. Better kill than being sued I guess...

    wasn't there a story about a 14 year old stabbing a 17 year old TWELVE times in self defence and got away with it? after reading that story I more or less accepted her killing as perfectly acceptable.

    Creatures
    Home Invasion Tips

    Home Invasion: Dangerous Criminals Rely on Scare Tactics



    Imagine it is the end of a long day. You and your family are spread about the house: your spouse in the study, your son in his room playing video games, your daughter dutifully doing the dishes, and you tinkering with your train set in the garage. You hear the doorbell ring; you go to answer, glancing at your watch and wondering who could be dropping by unannounced at this hour. You look through the peephole and see a nicely dressed man who claims, by yelling through the door, that his car broke down and he needs to use the phone. You open the door.



    You just made a big mistake.



    That nice young man has two buddies hiding out of sight, and the instant you open that door, all three pounce on you. You are pushed to the ground. Your screams bring your family running, though inside you desperately wish they would hide or even escape. But it’s too late. You are the victim of a home invasion, and now you and your family are in danger.



    Regular burglars work doing the day, breaking in during daylight hours when the home is usually unoccupied. They want to get in and get out with the loot, avoiding confrontation.



    Home invasion criminals are different.

    Home invasion criminals do their dastardly deeds at night, and their target is more than just the loot: it is often the residents. Single women, the elderly, or the wealthy are common home invasion targets. Home invasion robbers do it for more than just the spoils of war. Many get an adrenaline rush from the violence, the domination, and the fear they instill in you. Home invasion criminals are the most dangerous kind of criminal, and you must protect yourself and your family from home invasion with dedicated vigilance. There’s a reason people say the home is a castle –- it needs to be a well-secured battlement to protect you from home invasion.



    The first sixty seconds of a home invasion are the most violent; this is when the attackers often beat, subdue, or bound you and your family. Threats are made against your life, and the home invasion criminals stalk about your house looking for valuables to steal. They could take their sweet time, while you tremble with fear, bound and gagged on the floor, wondering what will happen to you and your family. Will there be sexual assault? Murder? You are helpless. All you can do is pray and wait for them to leave, and then try to get help.



    But you can prevent a home invasion.



    The same steps you take to secure your home when you are away are useful when you are at home.



    1. Lock all doors and windows at all times.



    2. Arm your burglar alarm even when you are there



    3. Stop forced entries with solid doors and reinforced locks.



    4. Create a home invasion panic room at the center of your home, with a deadbolt lock, sturdy door, first aid supplies, and a charged cell phone. Home invaders often cut the phone lines to prevent you from calling for help. Keeping a cell phone in your panic room allows you to call for help if the regular lines of communication are cut. Use a strip of tape...write your address on it and stick it next to your phone...in a panic you may not be able to remember it. Keep a flashlight nearby.



    5. Instruct your family to never open the door for an unexpected stranger. If someone comes to the door asking to use the phone, offer to make the call for them. Harmless people who really do need help understand that you are just being safe. Home invasion criminals, luckily, often just give up.



    6. Hold a family meeting and create a plan in the case home invasion. Make sure each family member knows what to do: escape out the back door if they can, or head for the panic room, and don’t fight back. Violence only escalates if the home invasion criminals become angry.



    It may seem like home invasions are impossible to prevent. Any criminal who really wants to get inside your home can just kick the door in. But precautions and common sense can keep most home invasion criminals from trying their luck with your home. You can enjoy your pleasant evenings home, knowing you and your family are safe in your well-fortified castle.

    The ONLY way to be prepared for a Break In , IS to be prepared PERIOD !!!!

    Whatcha do when they come for you ???

    Being Prepared is NOT being Paranoid , it's meeting the possibility of a life changing threat.

    Luckily,I have an "Early Warning System" Whether in the house or the backyard, Cody sounds off if there is someone around our property. You know the bark and I go into "Alert" mode.
    Don't ever be complacent .
    The Bad Guys aren't, believe me.....
  • January 8th, 2012, 10:09 AM
    Creatures
    Quote Originally Posted by tony_j15 View Post
    My current 80 grit sandpaper does me just fine, thanks.



    That's completely stupid, and I'm guessing you've given this precisely zero thought. Most instructors and practically all military will say the same thing: aim for center mass. Trying for a trick shot and hitting a leg, arm, or groin is stunt crap you see in bad movies. If someone is within 20ft (6 m) they have the possibility of actually getting to you before you can squeeze off a round/miss.

    Let's consider the situation: a frightened, 18 year old mother is having someone blasting into her house with a 12 inch bladed weapon. With the stress and adrenaline, the safest, most logical course of action is to aim for the biggest target. Center mass!

    Also, why the hell should someone have to play nice with an armed dangerous intruder when a victim's life could possible be on the line? Your pacifism in this matter is misguided.
    I admit the distances are bit short for trying to wound with a pistol or assault rifle, but a shotgun to the legs should be sufficient to stop him from charging.

    But the overall agreement was dead men don't tell tales and that's pretty much what I think. Better kill than being sued I guess...

    wasn't there a story about a 14 year old stabbing a 17 year old TWELVE times in self defence and got away with it? after reading that story I more or less accepted her killing as perfectly acceptable.

    Creatures
  • January 7th, 2012, 10:02 PM
    tony_j15
    Quote Originally Posted by Chuckiechan View Post
    And a Merry Christmas!

    Here's a present for you: LOL!
    My current 80 grit sandpaper does me just fine, thanks.

    What's wrong with that question? IMO people should be taught to incapacitate instead of killing.
    That's completely stupid, and I'm guessing you've given this precisely zero thought. Most instructors and practically all military will say the same thing: aim for center mass. Trying for a trick shot and hitting a leg, arm, or groin is stunt crap you see in bad movies. If someone is within 20ft (6 m) they have the possibility of actually getting to you before you can squeeze off a round/miss.

    Let's consider the situation: a frightened, 18 year old mother is having someone blasting into her house with a 12 inch bladed weapon. With the stress and adrenaline, the safest, most logical course of action is to aim for the biggest target. Center mass!

    Also, why the hell should someone have to play nice with an armed dangerous intruder when a victim's life could possible be on the line? Your pacifism in this matter is misguided.
  • January 7th, 2012, 06:50 PM
    Creatures
    Quote Originally Posted by tony_j15 View Post
    I tried to read this thread, but couldn't get past the stupidity of Creatures' first post.
    What's wrong with that question? IMO people should be taught to incapacitate instead of killing.

    Creatures
  • January 7th, 2012, 03:00 PM
    Chuckiechan
    And a Merry Christmas!

    Here's a present for you: LOL!
  • January 7th, 2012, 02:47 PM
    JLK03F150
    DRT is the perfect outcome for any armed home invader.
  • January 7th, 2012, 01:52 PM
    tony_j15
    Happy New Year to you too!
  • January 7th, 2012, 01:30 PM
    Chuckiechan
    And to retaliate, you are going to force everyone to get past yours? Grow up.
  • January 7th, 2012, 01:21 PM
    tony_j15
    I tried to read this thread, but couldn't get past the stupidity of Creatures' first post.
  • January 7th, 2012, 12:45 PM
    Chuckiechan
    Newt Gingrich and I share the belief that orphanages are a good thing. There are a lot of bad, drug and alcohol dependent "parents" who are "raising" "feral children", who bring mayhem to the community until they are incarcerated or killed.

    The democrats hate this idea, yet they will abort them before they are born, but won't try to save them once daylight hits their eyes.

    Regarding non fatal shots: Then you have to aim, and you might miss. It's best to "just do it" and not try to be a movie hero.

    Also, the 911 operator didn't tell her to "save herself", just "protect the baby". Suppose she was alone with no baby, would the operator have said to just "deal with it non violently"?
  • January 7th, 2012, 12:08 PM
    JEROY
    Well done Lady . You're a brave heart .
    I would do the same thing rather than feeling sorrow later for a child's loss .
  • January 6th, 2012, 09:46 AM
    Creatures
    Quote Originally Posted by Epidemic View Post
    you may think the time machine is a stupid idea but it would take alot of smart people to build it and contrary to your comment it would be a great idea to go back in time and make this guy a good person by putting him into another home or something during his formative years.

    You may think it is dumb, but you see if you can do it mr smarty pants
  • January 6th, 2012, 09:37 AM
    Epidemic
    you may think the time machine is a stupid idea but it would take alot of smart people to build it and contrary to your comment it would be a great idea to go back in time and make this guy a good person by putting him into another home or something during his formative years.

    You may think it is dumb, but you see if you can do it mr smarty pants
  • January 6th, 2012, 09:24 AM
    Creatures
    I'm not quite sure about this. she seems way more down to earth than a scared little girl. The phone call and the massive amounts of interviews afterwards made her look pretty tough.

    but did the guy know there was someone inside? I'm not pretty sure as there is no mention of it anywhere, sure someone moving a sofa towards the main door might make him know you are there but somethings off here, as there is really no mention of them knowing someone was inside

    then how does he know there are prescription drugs he might be interested in? yes he probably was once in that house to steal before BUT why didn't she report that? dogs being killed? why isn't that reported either?

    It's just me but the story IMO doesn't add up

    but yes I agree luckily she had something to defend with. I'm not arguing against that but as you said wounding would result in a more complex situation where the accused might have a chance to explain himself. maybe there was actually more behind the story than meets the eye.

    and the time machine idea might sound stupid but actually trying to find out why he was addicted AND breaking in to get drugs would be good in prevention of new such kind of people

    Creatures
  • January 6th, 2012, 09:06 AM
    Epidemic
    Creatures the biggest problem I have with this guy is that he had really gone pretty far off social norms.

    Attempting to break into an occupied house with a locked door for 20 minutes is an indication of serious breach of etiquette and social norms. This means this person is completely unpredictable, until the police arrive you neutralize the threat. The shotgun at 12 feet is not a real good weapon for wounding

    She was an 18 year old girl, who was confronted by a superior force, the shotgun had two shots.

    downside of wounding

    1) Lawsuit (he argues that he was invited)

    2) She misses and just pisses him off in drug induced rage.

    3) Do you know he is only armed with a knife. (someone breaks into your house 10 feet away you don't have a lot of time to assess the situation.)

    4) She is a little flustered by the event

    5) When aiming at someone where do you normally draw the Bead?

    Someone willing to break into an occupied house is prepared to do harm.

    facts not apparent to her at the time of the shooting but: note this guy had been stalking her so Rape was the almost certain outcome of an unarmed girl you were infactuated and with murder likely. Ps she had two of her dogs die leading up to the invasion (that is a little strange and one could possibly feel he was laying the ground work for the invasion)

    This guy was way more of a danger to society than a burglar, in retrospect her actions though harsh almost certainly saved her life and or the lifes of others because this clown was on a pretty evil path and an innocent was eventually gonna get in his way.

    Could she have blown his legs off and would that have worked? (yeah probably)

    But looking at the evidence provided at this point... Death was a far superior outcome of this situation.


    the only thing that would have been better is if he were jailed for life in anticipation of the situation. The best situation would have been identify the problems that lead to them, go back in a time machine and make this guy a good citizen not a thug.
  • January 6th, 2012, 06:33 AM
    Steve R Jones
    Quote Originally Posted by pickel View Post
    A common line in "Pirate" Movies..

    "Dead Men tell no Tales"
    Yeppers - one reason to shoot to kill is that there will only be one side to the story

    EDIT: Had she only wounded him - he would be screaming that he met her before and that she invited him over.... He knocked on the door and heard a baby crying and other weird sounds coming from inside....so he broke in thinking he'd save her....

    Then there's the part where she shot him with a double barrel shotgun which makes aiming for a wound shot kind of hard.
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