Building my first PC from scratch

[Goldenwayne]

Hi Im finally going to build my own PC, after years having fun only upgrading my old PCs.
But since its the first PC Im putting together Im not to sure on the parts. After some brief window shopping I came up with this build:

CPU:
Intel i7 2600K
Cooler:
Scythe Grand Kama Cross
Motherboard:
ASUS P8P67 EVO ( very unsure about the motherboard)
RAM:
Corsair DDR3 1600MHz 8GB (2x4GB)
Graphics card:
ASUS GTX 580 DCII
SSD:
Corsair Force Series GT 120 GB
HDD:
Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 (1000GB)
Case:
Coolermaster HAF X
PSU:
Corsair AX850 (I might upgrade to SLI later if I find out I need it)
Optical Drive:
Samsung SH-B123L/BSBP

This would cost me about 1860 CHF from the Shop im probably going to order from (STEG computer & electronics: Online-Shop für PCs & Heimelektronik) which is about 2000 USD.

I want this machine to run Battlefield 3, the Witcher 2 and Star Wars the old Republic at very high settings.
Did I miss anything? The budget is quite maxed out like this but if there is something thats more expensive but also boosts the power Im willing to go over the budget a bit more. Also if there is money to be saved somewhere I woudnt mind to hear about that aswell.
Thanks for your time

[JPMiller]

You want a Z68 chipset motherboard...
Newegg.com - GIGABYTE GA-Z68XP-UD3P LGA 1155 Intel Z68 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard
Has better options and the main thing,.... Intel smart response so that the 120 SSD and the HD can act as one fast drive

That PSU is overpriced...
I would go with this instead...
Newegg.com - OCZ OCZ750FTY 750W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Power Supply
Even at max load, extra drives, extra fans, upgrades, and another 580 in SLI you'll pull less than 740W on your worst day
Its Modular, reliable and has all the connectors needed for SLI

I would also reconsider that CPU cooler...
Poor design and not as good as MANY other options (CM 212 EVO for one)
Why did you pick that one?

I also assume your getting Windows 7 64bit?

[ShyguyXPC]

Changed up a few parts in that list from that site (added JP's board recommendation, same one I picked as well, didn't realize that until I added to the cart and saw his in the thread here, thinking on same wavelength )

The PSU, I didn't see any OCZ units on that site, but added the 850W XFX Non Modular PSU, which is MORE than enough, but far less in price than the modular, and even some of the non Modular units, Even the Non Modular Corsair 750W TX series (original and revised V2 versions) would be enough for that rig.

I think in the near 750-1KW range units it was Coolermaster, Thermaltake, FSP, Corsair & XFX that were available to choose from.

but I Changed the Video cards, the Asus 580's are Triple Slot cards, and would take up every available slot space on your motherboard, which isn't worth it IMO, as you'll want possible slots to add other things down the road, TV Tuner card, Sound Card, Network or Drive controller, etc. Maybe never, but you never know and its nice to have the options.

So I added the EVGA Dual slot cards, which in all honesty are better cards than the Asus in quality, Customer Service, and Warranty.

Added Corsair 8GB DDR3 1600MHz Vengeance RAM kit, the heatsinks on them aren't THAT tall, but that Kama Cross cooler, if oriented with the angled fins is over the RAM Slots it should clear them easily. Which if I remember right those angled fins are supposed to angle over the RAM, and the Rear power VRM's/Mosfets on the board anyways.

Otherwise all the parts are the same from your list.

Intel i7 2600K - Prozessoren / CPU - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

Corsair DDR3 1600MHz 8GB - Arbeitsspeicher - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

EVGA GTX 580 DS SC - Grafikkarten - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

Corsair Force Series GT - Festplatten & SSD - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 - Festplatten & SSD - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

Samsung SH-B123L/BSBP - Optische Laufwerke - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

Scythe Grand Kama Cross - Prozessoren / CPU - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

(Wasn't sure which version of the HAF X you were looking at but this is the basic version) Coolermaster HAF X - PC-Gehäuse - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

(Could spend cheaper a bit on this as well) XFX PRO850W Core Edition - PC-Netzteile - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

Gigabyte Z68XP-UD3P - Mainboards - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics



Total (inkl. MwSt.) CHF 1755.40

Bit cheaper than your original list and with IMO, A better Motherboard, Video card, & RAM (though not sure exactly which Corsair kit you were looking at to begin with)


Only thing missing the Operating system, Windows 7 64-bit, either Home or Professional is all you really need.

JP, I can't remember if you were the one or not that mentioned finding out "Home" only uses up to 16GB in 64-bit, but Pro allows more than that?

[Goldenwayne]

Thanks for the very valuable input guys. Not surprising I failed with the mainboard. Ive updated my shopping card with your suggestions, I think I will order tomorrow
Now while I have that much knowledge available Id like to ask a couple more questions:

Is the 580 the best card in this price range or should I take a a look at ATI cards also? I picked nvidia mostly out of habit, having always used them...

And since I have my screen connected via HDMI right now but the card you suggested has a mini hdmi output could i use something like this Roline HDMI-HDMI Mini Adap. - AV- & Monitor-Kabel - Kabel & Adapter - STEG computer & electronics without loosing qualitiy?


While putting the list together I picked the Grand Karma Cross mostly because it looks awesome, but maybe I should go with a more normal cooler like this one? Scythe Mugen 3 - Prozessoren / CPU - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

And lastly do I need to pick up thermal paste or does the cooler come with it?

Thank you very much for taking the time to help me out with this.

Edit: JPMiller I saw your edit after posting, Im also not so sure about that cooler now.
And yes I will use windows 7 64 bit, havent decided if Home Premium or Professional yet, any advice on that matter?

[ShyguyXPC]

You didn't fail, just that the Z68 chipset is the newest version for Intels, and Asus is usually VERY much Over Rated ( at least for their Motherboards and video cards, their other components and parts are actually pretty good, except Power supplies, but Displays, Sound cards, etc are pretty good)


As to the Video cards, for the Price range, the GTX 580 is the SINGLE most powerful single GPU card on the market, there is nothing better, aside from the Dual GPU GTX 590, or Radeon 6990, or some of the oddball Dual GPU Cards out there.

EVGA's GTX 460 2Win, which is a Dual GTX 460 card, is actually better than a 580, but is longer, uses more power, and you can not SLI to of the cards together, despite the fact they have SLI tabs on them. Visiontek I believe also has a Couple Dual GPU Radeon 6870 and 6950 Cards on the market as well, similar price range as the EVGA card, and slightly more powerful.

The EVGA card is around the same price or cheaper than a single 580, at least in the US here, the Radeon's from Visiontek I have never seen in the US, I know they exist in UK/EU though, these you could in theory run Crossfire with 2nd cards, or similar single GPU cards (Dual 6870 card can run with a single 6870 or 6850, dual 6950 with single 6970, 6950).

But since these are custom made cards from that company, AMD does not officially support them in their Drivers for Triple or Quad Crossfire.

the EVGA Dual 460 Card, is also a little buggy at times.

Asus also has some custom massively Overclocked/Overclockable monstrosities as well, but are MASSIVELY Overpriced, and absurd power requirements.

The top end single GPU Radeon currently (6970) ranks a bit higher than the GTX 570, and the 6950 ranks near the GTX 560 Ti.

basically for the price range that 580 is the best you can do, unless you can find a Dual GPU card (EVGA or Visiontek Cards mentioned) for same price range.

Downside is for games that don't cope well with SLI or Crossfire, your limited to single GPU Performance, and vastly inferior performance.

Also there are some games that get worse performance with SLI or Crossfire.

Most should be some sort of improvement. but its really hit or miss all over the board depending on the parts in the system, games, settings, drivers, etc.

In all honesty, for the price range, the 580 is still the best, the EVGA card, as kick ass as it is, is not THAT far ahead, but is in general cheaper, but if you have the length to mount the card, and the PSU to run it, its not a bad deal. Worse part of the card is the inability to Run SLI in Quad SLI mode.


As to the HDMI Adapter, yes, though I would think the card should come with an Adapter, but if it doesn't, no you won't lose any quality, its just a smaller version of HDMI connection. Many upper mid range and top end Tablets and Smartphones now have HDMI ports, usually mini HDMI which allow HD video to be played on TV from phones/tablets.



Unless your going to be overclocking the cooler isn't going to be a bit difference. Or if you run your PC in a warm environment.

The Kama Cross is a decent fan/cooler, would be fine, the Mugen 3 isn't going to be leaps and bounds better.

You could go with one of the Arctic Cooling, or Thermaltake ones as well, their pretty decent. Even Xigmatek's cooler is good.

I currently have a Xiggy in my current setup, and for my upgrades (hopefully soon, as I finally got Corsair to send out the defective part Overnight today) I have a Corsair H60 Water cooler kit, though one of the mounting screws was defective, but it should be a nice self contained water cooler kit for stock usage as well as light to moderate Overclocking.



As to Thermalpaste, the stock Intel Cooler already has it applied, you just attach the heatsink to the CPU/Board and its done.

Some of the Custom Coolers don't have it applied already, I know Xigmatek's Don't nor do some of the others like Thermaltake, Coolermaster, and a few others. SOME Of Arctic Coolings do though.

Corsair, depending on the cooler does and doesn't. The H60 for example does, but the A50 I think doesn't.

I couldn't hurt to pick up some though, just to have on hand.

Shin Etsu (There's actually several versions of Shin Etsu), & IC Diamond are some of the best top end ones IMO.

Arctic Silver 5, Arctic Silver Ceramique, and Arctic Cooling MX5 are some of the more common ones used by many out there, are also pretty good.

There are some others as well.

Many of the companies like Thermaltake and Coolermaster include their own brand of stuff with the cooler, usually far more than you'd ever need, and is usually decent grade paste, though usually not recommended for Overclocking, but for basic stock usage its fine.

Xigmatek, unless they changed, doesn't include any, nor does Corsair.


Any of the 5 I mentioned above though would be fine, I've used the stock Thermaltake, and Coolermaster stuff, but I usually use Ceramique or IC Diamond.

Though beware with IC Diamond, that since it uses Micronized Industrial Diamond Particles in its paste, that when you go to wipe off old paste or excess paste, that the diamond acts like really fine sandpaper and can actually wipe off the CPU info etching on the CPU's heatcap, making it hard to read the info on the cap. (I've even read some Overclockers even use IC Diamond when their lapping their Heatsinks bases as a fine grit sandpaper since its diamond particles)

[ShyguyXPC]

Edit: Forgot about JP's edit on that Cooler. I also do agree that the Coolermaster 212 series coolers, or the newer 412 that was just announced for Intel's New Socket 2011 that isn't even out yet (don't worry, it replaces socket 1366 not 1155. 1155 replaced 1156, so 2011 is for top end enthusiasts and Xeon server platform).

but I didn't see the Coolermaster Heatsinks from that retailer.

And depending on where that heatsink mounts on the motherboard, and room it has on the sides, the Corsair Vengeance RAM's heatsinks might prevent it from being mounted. Though Corsair does make some Vengeance RAM, same exact stuff, but with out the spikey heatsinks.

But some of the 1600 Rated Patriot that was listed on that site should be fine as well.

But I'd try to find some 1600 Rated RAM with a 1.5V Voltage. those should run at the 1600 Rated speed when overclocking on DDR3 stock spec voltage of 1.5V.

Looks like Corsair has a 1.35V kit as well: Corsair DDR3 1600MHz 8GB - Arbeitsspeicher - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

Though don't know if its worth the price increase.

Is there any other good online retailers near your area, that would be options for buying some of the parts from?

[RicheemxX]

Only thing missing the Operating system, Windows 7 64-bit, either Home or Professional is all you really need.

JP, I can't remember if you were the one or not that mentioned finding out "Home" only uses up to 16GB in 64-bit, but Pro allows more than that?

Interesting I didn't know that. I thought it would be the same across the board however its 16gbs for home prem, and only 8gb for home basic
Memory Limits for Windows Releases

[Goldenwayne]

Wow thanks again shyguyXPC!
If I understand correctly the 580 should be the most "futureproof" as I can add another one if I need more power right?
I tried my usual suspects for the more exotic cards you mentioned and the only thing I found is this ASUS MARS II GTX 580x2 - Grafikkarten - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics which you must have ment with stupidly overpriced.
Im happy that you waved away all the doubts I had about the 580.

As for Overclocking the way I understand it would be a waste to get i7 2600k and not at least overclock it slightly woudnt it? So Im looking for a cooler that would support that, I think Ill led the cross go since purely choosing it on looks would probably be stupid.

Ill throw in some thermal paste just to be sure.
Great to know that the adapter should be included, if not I should be able to pick one up locally without any problems.

As far as other retailers in my area there is:
digitec online shop
and
http://www.brack.ch/
I have to admit that I have only compared stegs prices with amazon.de, and Id like to order the big part of my order from steg, since in my experience their customer service is really good, even if they chare a couple of bucks more for the stuff.
But if something is only available somewhere else feel free to recommend it anyway.

As far as the RAM goes I must admit that you lost me with the different Corsairs.
Are those spiky heatsinks useful? And whats the difference between 1.35V and 1.5V kits?
And since this is the first PC i pick the windows version myself Im still confused if I need Professional or not?

[ShyguyXPC]

With the RAM, the heatsink spikes are just extra surface Area to cool the RAM when Overclocking. I bought my kit like it, 6GB (3x 2GB) Triple channel kit, before I found out there was a version with out the spikes, though since I'm installing a Corsair H60 watercooler kit, it doesn't matter one way or the other, since I won't have any obstructions to worry about.

But most DDR3 even running at 1600MHz really doesn't NEED a heatsink or cover to it, but it does help and keep it cooler.

some of the Patriot stuff listed, or even the Kingston is fine.

DDR3's Spec for Voltage is 1.5V, thats standard across the line. From what I remember reading is that most boards with decent OCing options will support up to 1.65V.

1600 is an Overclock Rated Speed.

Running the CPU at stock clocks, the RAM should be running at 1066 or 1333MHz, but the ram is guaranteed to run at 1600.

sometimes when Overclocking you need to bump up the voltage to maintain a stable Overclock.

but getting 1600 Rated stuff at 1.5V... or less, its one less thing to possibly fiddle with, if your going to run at 1600.

most of the 1.65V Rated 1600, needs 1.65V to run, but if your Motherboard doesn't support voltages that high, it might not let you run at 1600 Stable.

from what I understand. Which is why I looked for the best 1.5V 1600 kit I could find.

1.35V just runs undervolted at the rated speed.

less voltage means less heat as well.


As to the i7 2600K, generally if someone plans on buying a 2500 or 2600 and no OC plans I usually recommend they just buy the non K and save a few bucks, but even if you don't OC now, and wait till a year or so down the road, spending a few bucks more on the K would be worth it.

As it is, you probably won't need to OC for sometime (as with most gamers really), even with Dual 580's in the system.

Unless you get the Overclocking Bug and want to for fun like some here and other sites. But its just one option to maintain future proofing of your system.



as to the version of windows. Most are fine with Home Premium 64-bit. up to 16GB of RAM can be used with it.

Professional is much more. Your Motherboard can support a max of 32GB, but for a gaming PC, even 8GB is overkill.

For a system like mine, which is Gaming, but I also play with Video Editing, Music creation, 3D Graphics and other programs that can eat up RAM, and my board supports up to 24GB of RAM. Professional would be a better option for me. I wasn't aware of the RAM limits on various versions of Windows 7, aside from Windows 7 Starter Editions 2GB Limit, since it was aimed at Netbook's and their minimalistic Specs.

otherwise I would of bought Professional a year & half ago.

but I currently run 6GB in my System, the current board has all 6 slots occupied, but my new board has 6GB (Corsair Vengeance) and only uses 3 Slots, so I can upgrade more if necessary. But I will only be able to to add another 6GB, before I hit that 16GB limit (or remove the 6GB, install 3GB and add in a 12GB kit giving me 15GB instead), unless I Upgrade to Professional.


If this is purely, and primarily a PC gaming rig, you should be fine with Home Premium 64-bit, and the 16GB limit.

it'll be a long time before Gaming PC's will need 16GB let alone 8GB to run.

[ShyguyXPC]

Looking at that Digitec site, the best comparable deal they have for the EVGA 580 is a Gigabyte 580, its only 2MHz slower on clock speed, has 3 fans, should be quieter running, not by much though.

Gigabyte GTX-580 UD 1.5GB DDR5, PCI-E 2.0 x16

And is a bit cheaper.

Gigabyte ain't bad for cards, but EVGA is still preferred due to Warranty, Customer Service and what not, at least over here in the US.

Not really sure how great EVGA is over sea's, since there are other brands like XFX (though only sells Radeon cards now), and some others like Point Of View (POV), Gainward, Palit, and others that have a bit more market dominance over in UK/EU than EVGA does I think.

MSI is a pretty good brand as well, but don't see any good deals for 580's from them.


If it weren't my own personal preference for EVGA (actually EVGA, XFX, and MSI), I'd consider the Gigabyte, which is still a good brand as well, for about 20 less in price, its not too bad really.

[Goldenwayne]

While checking digitec i stumbled upon this card ProdukteDetails2 would it be worthwhile to spend more money to get this card?
otherwise Ill get either get the EVGA or the Gigabyte...

And is this fan good or overkill?
Xigmatek Aegir SD128264 - Prozessoren / CPU - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics


I think Ill hold of the order for this weekend and fiddle around some more
Thanks again for your time

[ShyguyXPC]

Price wise on that MSI Lightning, not really, considering its over 100 more in cost, for only a bit/moderate OC higher, its not going to be worth the performance increase for that cost.

the card is GOOD, but the price increase doesn't warrant it for the few extra frames a second you might get.

considering the 580 is already at the top of the food chain (Barring any Dual GPU Cards from the list), its not going to make a big improvement.

For the CPU Cooler, it should be good, but for the price, I wouldn't.

Any of these would be as good if not better due to the lower price:

Scythe Mugen 2 Rev. B - Prozessoren / CPU - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

Arctic Cooling Freezer Xtreme Rev.2 - Prozessoren / CPU - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

Arctic Cooling Freezer 13 Pro - Prozessoren / CPU - PC-Komponenten - STEG computer & electronics

[ShyguyXPC]

On Digitec, here's one of the Coolermaster 212 Series like JP was mentioning (Not exact same model, but same series)

Cooler Master RR-B10-212P-GP Hyper 212 Plus (Don't have the link for it, but thats the model/listing.)



Looking at some other coolers on that site, these aren't bad either.


Xigmatek Gaia SD1283 Heatpipe Cooler 120mm

Akasa Venom Nano CPU-Kühler AK-CC4005SP01 - 100mm

Arctic Cooling Freezer Xtreme Rev.2

All In One Water Cooling Kit from CoolIt (the current crop of Corsair H60, H80 and H100 Coolers are actually joint venture between Corsair and CoolIt as well, so you know your getting a similar quality kit)

CoolIT ECO, all-in-one Mini-Wakü CPU-Cooler


All of those less than the Xigmatek on Steg, from Digitec instead.


For the price of that Xiggy, you could end up with one of these from Digitec instead: Prolimatech Armageddon CPU-Cooler

Which is a much better cooler over all. So is this Thermalright: Thermalright MUX-120 Black Multisocket Cooler


Personally the for the price the CoolIT Water cooling kit has my vote, but for the lower priced spectrum, the Coolermaster 212, Xigmatek Gaia, and lower priced Arctic Cooling coolers have my vote for regular active air heatsink coolers.

[Goldenwayne]

Im a bit scared of the watercooler idea, because well Im running water through some expensive hardware and Im afraid to mess something up.
But this cooler seems quite idiot proof When thinking about it makes a lot of sense since all the other stuff should be colder inside the PC if the CPU heat is transfered off like that.

But where would I put that radiator? I think Id need to take out one fan from the back woudnt I?
That should be easy to do so shouldnt it?
That watercooler should be golden for overclocking shoudnt it?
The more I think about it the more awesome a watercooler seems
Thanks for your time again.

[ShyguyXPC]

They are, their completely self contained, and its rare for them to leak. Even if they do, their not Water. But they should be covered under warranty and any parts damaged by them should be covered. At least with Corsair they are, I would think CoolIT would be as good with warranty as well, and have never really heard anything bad about them either.

Antec, also has some similar kits as well, and decent too.

Corsair in the next month or so, should have their new budget H40 kit in stock at retailers, may be 2 months or so outside the US I think.

The Radiator mounts on a 120mm Fan Position in the rear of the case.

Optimally its recommended to have a Push/Pull Fan configuration, basically Two 120mm Fans (or some models, 140mm fans) sandwich the cooler, and blow air in one direction, either out of case, or as per Corsairs recommendations take air in from back in to the case.

I know the Corsair kit takes only 10 minutes or so to install on the motherboard, assuming you don't run into the snag I had (defective screw for securing the whole thing).

I think the CoolIT kit is a similar mounting design.

for mild to moderate OCing these kits are fine for Heavy OCing its recommended to have a custom built setup.

But most Heatsink/Fan setups are just as good for OCing as the Watercooler kits. Only reason I listed it, was its price range. Normally these kits are much higher in price (that Xigmatek one you found, that price range or higher)

It really depends on your setup, preferences, and what not as well.

if you got the watercooler kit, I'd ditch the stock fan and get 2 identical spec fans for push pull, or at least down the road do that, if and when you OC, then get 2 newer fans, but for stock speeds, and even mild OC's the fan it comes with should be fine.

Most likely someone will recommend the Scythe Gentle Typhoon 120mm 1300 or 1400RPM model fans, though they are impossible to find, since the factory that made them was destroyed in Japans Quake earlier this/Last year. I ended up Picking up, a couple expensive Noctua 120mm Fans ($25 a piece). Akasa's 120mm Viper (or maybe it was Venom, I forget) fans are good too, basically the 120mm version of the fan on the Akasa Heatsink listed in reply above.

Some people have even mounted/modded these kits to attach the Radiator to the top case fans, or front drive bays/fan position.

There are even Modders out there that take these kits apart and mod them with better radiators, and connections, or even add a 2nd Waterblock attached to the GPU for cooling, using the kit as a basis to add more to.


Though I will admit having a Watercooler kit like that installed, does add a level of style and cleanliness inside the case with out a large tower cooler installed. Also leaves plenty of room for doing further upgrades with out the heatsink getting in the way.

If you get the watercooler, pick up some Shin Etsu or IC Diamond paste to go with it, in case you need to replace the paste or reapply paste.


For affordability though the CM 212 or Xiggy Gaia are the best choices IMO. Its been a couple/few years since I used the Arctic Cooling Freezer Series coolers, but they were always rock solid when I had them as well.

I still use some of Arctic Coolings Suspended Open Frame fans for Heatsinks and Exhaust fans though.

[Goldenwayne]

So for the coolit system id ideally pick up 2 of those or alike right?
ProdukteDetails2

Surprisingly they actually do carry the gentle typhoon series:ProdukteDetails2
Im a bit confused though about the RPM, they have a 1450rpm and a 1150rpm model for the same price. I the 1450rpm should be louder and more powerful, but which would I need?

I think Im convinced.
But looking at the case Im not sure which of the fans it the "sandwich" should replace.
There is an airfllow chart witch all the fans on this site:
HAF X - Cooler Master - Leading Provider of Computer Case | Cooler | Power Supply

[ShyguyXPC]

The AP-14's are not loud at all, not for the performance you get from them.

I'd say, if it is an actual AP-14 model, GRAB THEM (Sold Out almost EVERYWHERE in the US here, thats how popular they are, only ones you can find are 1100, 1200 or so RPM models), their a better deal than the Noctua's.

Oooh, I just looked up, and seems FrozenCPU.com (out of the US here) has GT AP-15's for sale... If I hadn't already bought the Noctua's I'd grab those.

If the site your looking at has the AP-15's, grab a couple of those, otherwise the AP-14 you linked to are good also, should be a bit quieter than the 15's.

I only grabbed the Noctua's (Same models you linked to) as I got fed up trying to find some good recommended fans for the H60 cooler I have. I also had a coupon code to use on Newegg to save some cash, so I did that.

And I didn't want to pay the premium price of the Noctua's, but really had little choice.

I still paid nearly $40 for the 2 fans.

as to where the the sandwiched Radiator goes, the Rear 120mm Fan in that HAF X case (can't remember if its 120 or 140, but you can mount either size on it) is where the sandwich goes. Might have to check with CoolIT's instructions as to which direction the recommend the fans blow (either from back to inside like Corsair, or from inside out back), but that would determine the direction to mount the fans on the Radiator.

I don't know if the CoolIT comes with extra Fan screws or not, Corsairs coolers only come with one set to mount the fan to the radiator, and needs extra screws to add a 2nd fan, though some modders just get similar threaded extra long screws from the hardware store, or I've seen some just use Zip Ties to fasten the fans to the radiator, and then mount the rear facing fan to the case to hold the whole thing.

[Goldenwayne]

After a good nights sleep Ive decided not to go with the watercooler and I also picked a diffrent case.
case: ProdukteDetails2

Ill pick up one of the fans you recommended.

But my real problem is with the graphicscard since the card you recomended initially is on backorder and would need a couple of weeks to arrive.
so I could go with the card you also recommended:
ProdukteDetails2
or this EVGA card
ProdukteDetails2
then there are is also this Zotac card
ProdukteDetails2
or this MSI card:
ProdukteDetails2
or this one:
ProdukteDetails2
And this Gainward card
ProdukteDetails2
Those are all ready to be sent out immediately which is important to me .
Once the card and fan are done Im going to order

[ShyguyXPC]

The EVGA you linked there (no Picture) is the same exact card as the one out of stock, if I remember right there was two revisions of it, EVGA does that quite often, they usually have 2 versions of cards, one with a 3 year or so warranty and another with a Lifetime Warranty, as well as sometimes make minor improvements to the design of the cards, or updated with some new components on the board and released as an incremental newer revision card.

the card listed there for all intents and purposes should be the same exact one, its also possible it just has a different cooler design as well.

And I was right, that 2nd EVGA linked above there, is this one: EVGA | Products

Model #'s match up, has a more stock standard style cooler, but is exact same specs as the other one out of stock.

Zotac is ok, they make a lot of motherboards and even Video cards for other companies, but their Customer Service isn't all that great over here.

The Gigabyte Board is a good one, nice cooling.

The Gainward is Overkill with 3GB, not worth it, only good for 2 or more Displays for Spanned screen Gaming. (and even then, the multiple displays need to be 1920x1080 or greater spanned across the screens before you'll see an improvement over a single 1.5GB model)



The MSI's are GREAT cards, they don't have EVGA's Rep for Warranty, and Customer Service, but MSI isn't that bad really, only just above Average IMO. The Cards on the other hand are known to be great performing cards, and good overclockers.

The Twin Frozr III card is a good one, but the lesser Frozr II is pretty Good as well, Though one of the main complaints of the cards is the PCB board they're made of (at least for the II models), is a bit thin, and with the length of the card and weight of the cooler the board can flex a little (sag a bit at the end, when in the slot).

not a big deal if the case is going to be stationary most of the time IMO, and its more or less petty nit picking, but its one thing I hear about the cards a lot. Not sure on the III models though.


but my picks would be the EVGA, or one of the MSI's. (but then again, I'm mainly a fan of those 2 companies anyways LOL)

Though the Gigabyte one isn't bad either.

but I would go for one of the other 3 (EVGA or MSI) I think the MSI models fans should be quieter running than that EVGA models fan (like the Zotacs fan).

[Goldenwayne]

Great, Ill pick one of the card and order tomorrow, should be able to start building on tuesday. Ill probably be pack with building problems though .
I will also post some pics of the building maybe some people will find them fun to see.

Thanks again for helping me such a huge amount, this is easily the most useful forum Ive ever asked for help on.