CPU runs on the hot side

[ladykrimson]

Hi there,

I am new on the forums.

I have an ASRock P4VM8 motherboard with a Pentium 4 3.06GHz processor, 2GB RAM. My processor has always run on the hot side, and I have been told that it is typical of the 3.06 processors. The idle temp is about 104 degrees, but if I try to do anything involving the Flash Player via Firefox, the temp skyrockets to 145 degrees, at which point my system freezes and crashes.

Does anyone have any suggestions on how to cool my system a bit?

[Detritus]

Have you tried opening the side and blowing some of the dust out of the heatsink and fans with pressurized air? That's the quickest and least invasive way to get better cooling efficiency out of the fans. Take the system outside if possible before blowing it out, it can make quite a mess. If that doesn't help, and you are skilled in the art, you can try reseating the heatsink and fan on the processor and replace the thermal paste on the heatsink.

[ladykrimson]

Have you tried opening the side and blowing some of the dust out of the heatsink and fans with pressurized air? That's the quickest and least invasive way to get better cooling efficiency out of the fans. Take the system outside if possible before blowing it out, it can make quite a mess. If that doesn't help, and you are skilled in the art, you can try reseating the heatsink and fan on the processor and replace the thermal paste on the heatsink.

Thank you for your advice. Unfortunately, my CPU has always run this hot, even directly after a cleaning. I clean my computer out once per two weeks (I have animals and a smoker living with me), and I have a steady supply of thermal paste. I have tried different fans and different heatsinks, but it still runs hot.

I keep the side panel off my system so that she can breathe, but I really don't like doing that. I was wondering if I need to get some kind of better cooling fan or another case fan.

[ShyguyXPC]

Are these temps you listed in Fahrenheit or Celsius?

[stroyal]

If it runs cool enough, with the side panel off, you need better case cooling.

If you case fans are not keeping the inside of the case, within 2 or 3 degrees of room temp, your case cooling can be improved.

The best case cooling, will keep the inside of the case the same as the outside, all my rigs have always been set up that way.



The test for the lowest, you can get your CPU,with that heat-sink is, with the side off, place a window or box fan blowing into the case, that way, you are only testing the CPU cooler.

Oh, don't forget F, or C scale.
And welcome to TechIMO!

[ladykrimson]

These temperatures are in Fahrenheit.

I have the panel off and a fan blowing on it, and the temperature stays at 106 F...unless I use a program that uses integrated Flash Player or Java (such as Facebook applications or POGO accounts). The temperature steadily rises at that point.

The case has an unusual set up.The power supply vents out of the bottom of the case. Like so:



I keep the case laying on its side.

I have had this processor for a few years, and it has transferred from motherboard to motherboard. It has remained the only constant. All other components have changed (motherboard, RAM, video cards, sound cards, cases, hard drives, power supplies, heatsink, CPU fan, and case fans). It has always run hot, but I have managed to keep the case well-ventilated.

For some reason, the last couple of weeks or so, it burns hot enough to freeze up my system...even with the two case fans and the table fan and the side panel removed. Each fan is working perfectly, spinning at its maximum rpm. I recently cleaned out the heatsink and the CPU fan and applied a thin coat of thermal paste.

Are there other alternatives for cooling a hot CPU? Should I just replace the processor? Should I invest in other cooling methods?

[JLK03F150]

Is the hard drive bay fan blowing in and motherboard fan blowing out?

This was the heat problem with a LGA775 Pentium 4 system of mine...
(click image for full size)

[ladykrimson]

Is the hard drive bay fan blowing in and motherboard fan blowing out?

This was the heat problem with a LGA775 Pentium 4 system of mine...
(click image for full size)

The hard drive fan is intake...the motherboard fan is out. It it supposed to be another way?

I have some computer knowledge (friend-taught then self-taught), but I am still working to refine what I know.

[JLK03F150]

Your case seems a little odd (non-standard), but an airflow rule of thumb is fans in front and on the side blow into the case. Fans on top and in the back blow out of the case.

Your case configuration seems like it should work fine. Can you hear the CPU fan pick up speed as the temperature increases towards 62C?

[ladykrimson]

Your case seems a little odd (non-standard), but an airflow rule of thumb is fans in front and on the side blow into the case. Fans on top and in the back blow out of the case.

Your case configuration seems like it should work fine. Can you hear the CPU fan pick up speed as the temperature increases towards 62C?

Absolutely.

[stroyal]

If the temps are the same, and react the same with the window fan blowing into the case, then your case cooling is fine.
The problem must be in your CPU cooling.

You can NEVER do better than room temperature, for internal case temps, unless you are using a refrigerated case.

The window fan guarantees that the inside of the case is the same as room temp.

If the thermal past, and contact, are indeed correct,@145f/63c, the heat sink should be too hot to touch for more than a second or 2.(the heat sink should be close to the same temp as the CPU)
120f/49c is usually considered max hand touch. (still quite hot though)

After grounding yourself to the case, carefully brush a finger across the heat sink, if it is not very hot, try touching it longer until you determine how hot it is. If it is not hot, when reading 145f, then your problem is the thermal paste, or the contact.

Paste too thick is a problem also. when you remove the heat sink, the past should be opaque, and almost not there, if it was applied properly. Too much will cause overheating.

Paste is not an enhancer, it is only for making 100% contact, filling in the spaces that do not contact directly.(metal to metal contact)

No paste made can transfer heat better than direct contact.(it is an extra step in the cooling path)
On a microscopic basis, the paste fills the usually extremely tiny voids between the CPU, and the cooler.

If you could make a perfectly flat mirror finish, on both the CPU and heat sink, with 100% contact, paste would not be needed. (not practical, and maybe impossible)

[ladykrimson]

Paste too thick is a problem also. when you remove the heat sink, the past should be opaque, and almost not there, if it was applied properly. Too much will cause overheating.

Paste is not an enhancer, it is only for making 100% contact, filling in the spaces that do not contact directly.(metal to metal contact)

I did not know this...thank you. I will try cutting down on the paste.

[stroyal]

I did not know this...thank you. I will try cutting down on the paste.

You are not alone, a lot of people, don't know what it is for.

Some old all aluminum heat sinks are so bad in smooth and flat, that they can't work without too much paste.

If you have an all aluminum heat sink, it could have warped, and in that case should be replaced.

I don't know how handy you are, but heat sinks can be lapped, smooth and flat on a surface plate, with lapping compound, or emery cloth, followed by crocus cloth.
A piece of glass, can be used for a lapping block.
store bought blocks are made of cast iron, or granite.

In the old days, before serious heat sinks, over-clockers lapped the heat sink, directly to the CPU die, for as perfect a contact as you can get

The lapping block is also how you see if it is not flat
Good luck.

If you need more detail, let us know, I don't want to type a book, until I know you want it.

[ladykrimson]

So how do I find out the metal out of which my heatsink is made?

I will look into the lapping block. It sounds like it may be handy.

[stroyal]

So how do I find out the metal out of which my heatsink is made?

I will look into the lapping block. It sounds like it may be handy.

They are usually aluminum color, and are very light, if it just aluminum.(some older ones where painted black though),


The next type will be aluminum, with a copper insert,that contacts the CPU.
The Idea here is that copper absorbs hear faster than aluminum, but aluminum gives off heat faster than copper. These as somewhat heaver than plane copper of course.

The next non phase change type, would be all copper, very heavy and copper colored.

Beyond that you have the phase change type, that have tubes, and are made of copper and aluminum, also.

When I run into a warped heat sink nowadays, I'm not as critical as I used to be, so what I use, Is a piece of 600 emery cloth, then a sheet of crocus cloth.

Instead of setting up my lapping block, I just lay the cloth on a piece of counter top, and rub the heat sink on that.
Flat is the most important part.

As you lap you should look at the bottom every few seconds.
You will see that in the beginning that the cloth is only sanding spots.

When those spots spread out to cover the whole bottom surface evenly, you are done.
Rotate the sink every few strokes to make it even, as when you push it back in forth, you won't get even pressure. I go 180, 90, then 180 over and over.

It will only take a few minute.

If you can't find crocus cloth, don't worry about it 600 emery is good enough for aluminum.

Crocus is so fine, it feels like a smooth sheet of cloth, but it will sand metal to the beginnings of a mirror finish.

Wash it with hot soap and water after.

Have Fun

[ladykrimson]

You were 100% correct. The heatsink is not transferring the heat from the CPU. I touched the heatsink while it was running, and it was only warm to the touch...not hot.

I think I may buy a new processor, heatsink, and fan. I've had this one for years, so it's time to replace it.

[ShyguyXPC]

Should also add you only need about a BB sized or slightly smaller bead of Thermal paste on the CPU/Heatsink, spread out evenly.

Some recommend the size of a grain of Rice, but it varies from paste to paste and the area of contact needed.

[stroyal]

When you take off the heat sink, check the contact, by examining the old paste.
You should be able to read it like a book.

If it is still thick everywhere, then the clamping device may have a problem, or you put too much on.
If there are thin spots, and thick spots, the heat sink is not flat.

[JLK03F150]

Here's a P4 I remounted. This is the CPU and heatsink with the old paste.



I cleaned the old paste with paper towel & tissue paper and 91% rubbing alcohol.



Here's the cleaned heatsink and the CPU with a dab of Arctic Silver 5 on it. Notice it is not very much, but plenty to make good contact between the CPU & heatsink.